The Grammy-Winning Exec Who RISKED IT ALL! (ft. Kei Henderson)

I am not anti-label. I am anti selling yourself short. Fast money goes faster. Yeah, just ask a stripper. And that's marketing 101 is knowing who you're speaking to. Because some people are visionless if we're being honest. When three goats of the music industry basically say that ain't it about your artists. No, but you have to have this unwavering faith in yourself. You want grandma's gumbo, you don't want a hot pocket. No, we're in Stone Mountain. Where are we at? This is Stone Mountain. This is the heart of racism. You know how racist they are? It took me two years to get Key Henderson on the podcast, but damn it, we did it. Key is a Grammy winning music exec who's known for managing 21 Savage and co-founding since the 80s, who's an Atlanta-based record label, home to Jid, EARTHGANG, and so many of your favorite acts. On today's episode, we talk about her Leap of Faith starting her very own management, publishing, and label company called Third in Hayden. She gave us all the sauce about exactly how she's helping her super diverse roster of artists win in 2024. This one is a must watch.

Let's get right into it. And then we do it one more time. One more time. Spin it, rock, spin it, one more time. Hit me, baby, one more time. Coke Zero. I'm really impressed with that record. Coke Zero. Because Jingle's gotta be funner. Yeah. Or if you know if you listen to V103, like they're like commercials are like bops. They're Not like regular commercials. Yeah. They have great hip hop beats. Beats, yeah. Did Southside produce this? Yeah, exactly. They have good verses. You know. So do you think Henry has a hit on his hands? I'm not gonna hold you. I think that's a really fun record. I'm so mad. I think it's really good. I'm so mad right now. Are you jealous? I mean, I never thought that we'd have a Grammy winning executive Key Henderson on the podcast, shouting out one of Henry's original records about Coke Zero and his love relationship with the soda. I was maybe gonna do a faceless, you know, artist behind that so we're exposing that. not anymore.

That's okay. It's out there. If they watch the podcast, they know. Yeah, that's cool. Right, they know it's you. Oh man, Key, appreciate you coming on the pod. Thank you so much. Finally, huh? I feel like the episodes that have been a little bit like tougher to schedule have always been the best. The bangers. Yeah. So I have like pressure. I know. I have like extremely high hopes for this one because I feel like we were gonna do this like a year and a half ago before, you know. I actually like to refer to things before the Drake share. You know, it's like BC before the Drake share. PD. What, post-Drake? PD, Yeah, post-drake, pre-Drake. Yeah, exactly. That was a real turning point for the pod. Wait, which episode did he share? Uh the KYY Engineering. Oh, I love that. Yes, yeah. Because yeah, it was an epic like story about the making of forever. It also made Drake look like super fine. I know. So it was easy. we set him up for the share. It was an alley-oop, bro. Yeah, but so obviously I want to get to all things third in Hayden, which is your you know most recent venture. But you were a co-founder of since the 80s. Yes.

Home to JID, EARTHGANG, Sofago, you know, other artists at this point. All your favorites. Um, you know, I know that was a big decision for you to part ways with you know that team. What did you think you were gonna do when you left, right? Like, what was the original plan? Because I think it's different than third and Hayden. Yeah, yeah. No, we we all have it's so funny. Um, the original plan, right? Because I'm I'm getting older. I'm yo. Yeah, I know. It's crazy. 25 is not that old. It's not old. Thank you. Very much. Uh I I I was really craving stability. Like, obviously, this is during a time during the pandemic where everything was very, very up in the air. Like, you know, we had plans that got completely derailed. We had artists that were headed on tour, didn't go on tour, everything was canceled, and I was just very in a weird space. I think a lot of us were. But I thought I was gonna go work inside of a label. I'm like, I can get some health benefits, maybe I can adopt a kid if I wanted to, or like freeze my eggs and do the whole thing, because doing that as an independent entrepreneur, all that stuff's really expensive. So I'm like, I'm just gonna go inside of a label, somebody that's like still an indie and then still boutique, and then that just it completely fell through.

But shout out to Jay Irving, like I even hit him up last a few months ago, like yo, because I ripped him to shreds on Twitter, by the way. So I found out somebody else got the job. Oh shit on Twitter. And you took to Twitter to voice your of course I did. I'm so emotional. Because Kei is a big tweeter. That's what Twitter's about? I got most of my research from Kei's Twitter feed. Love it. For sure. Some people aren't active on Twitter, and it's really hard to research you guys, but it's really easy when Kei's just firing off. You can be the most impulsive on Twitter. It's so easy. It's Right off the brain. You can't just fire like Instagram reel off. Nah, real quick. It's Way more edited. Yeah. Twitter is just like whatever the fuck I'm thinking. Twitter is the superior social media, hands down. You love it. Oh, I love Twitter. You love it. Yeah. So you so you fire shots being like a thousand percent. I mean, I what did you say? It was something to the along the lines of like nobody even knows this guy. The person that they hired me. Shit. So not only was it guy. Right. Not only J. Irving, and it was the guy that got hired.

I was just like, no one even knows you. Like, I and sorry to that man. I don't I really don't know that man. So maybe I'm the only one. I might be the only one that doesn't, though. What if you were? It's possible. What if the whole industry knows this guy? What if he's a legend in this industry? Everybody but me knows him. Yeah, and that's possible. I mean, it's not really possible, actually. It's probably not. No, but I was I was pissed. Yeah, I was pissed. So but thankfully, though, before I had even fully accepted the job, because what happened was they sent me the healthcare benefits of package. Oh shit. And then I was just waiting to have another call with Jay Irving. So you were deep in the process. Deep. Like super deep. Okay. It wasn't like told Barry and Zeke, like, yo, I'm about to just do this label thing. Sorry, guys. Like, I'm tired. I'm a tired black woman. I'm just gonna go work for people. Um, which has never been my thing. I've never been a good employee. I think everyone that I've ever worked for has, you know, loved me to death, but been like, You're the worst assistant on the planet. And I appreciate that honesty.

It's like I'm not a worker. So it actually worked out better that it didn't work out, but you know, in the midst of that, I was still gonna manage artists. So I had to like I restarted my company as third in Hayden, but only to manage the artist that I was still working with, which was Azion and Third and um, excuse me, Jordan. Okay. So because I was taking them from since the eighties, I was still gonna work with them, but currently under that like understanding, I was gonna be like a full-time label employee with like the side business of doing management, because they were in the developing stages. So I was supposed to give a list to you know, uh the Sony human resources people, like here's the list, you know, for the non-compete portions, and then I just never heard from Jay again. Whoa. Yeah. Still haven't no, no, no, we've talked about it. Okay. I was like, after I ripped him to shreds and he was like Let's talk. Well, no, it wasn't even that. He was just like, yo, you're too you're passionate, like you're like me. You're so passionate. And he was like, I really respect that. And I was like, Yeah, I had to apologize. Cause sometimes you got like you get that humble pie. You know what I'm saying?

It's just like we heard about that, T-Ron. Why am I wilding out? Like, why am I ripping this guy to shreds on Twitter who obviously, like obviously has a lot of respect for me, wanted to work for me. We had a really good like bond and like relationship, and I'm just like, man, fuck this guy. Oh man. Okay. So then when that falls through, you obviously still had the management clients, but was it was it something where you were gonna like try and apply for another label gig? Or was that the that was it? It was like that was the sign where it was like, okay, enough. This is not for me. Yeah, sure. Yeah. And so then what was the vision behind Third and Hayden, right? Like what what did we decide? Because I actually found a tweet. Oh, here we go. Do you remember your tweet from 2016? Oh, that one. That was that you retweeted recently. No, it's because you retweeted it recently, kind of. Oh, did I? Yeah, so you basically retweeted it recently where you were like, in 2016, you said, I'm gonna start a boutique label. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And it was gonna be like more of a marketing photo, you know, like you said something that basically perfectly aligns with like what I kind of see Third and Hayden being today. Yeah. So like you kind of already had that like forethought. And I know since the eighties probably has some of the elements that like you now have applied to Third and Hayden, but like what what's the vision for Third and Hayden right now? Just so we set the stage. It's very similar to since the eighties, right? Where it's management, label, and publishing. Our kink is really working with artists from the very beginning, right? And and bringing something from zero to either 50, 60, or even a hundred. if we, you know, stay with an artist through the lifetime of their career. But that's always been what me, Barry and Zeke were very passionate about. And so it's still that, right? But the only difference is is this particular chapter is just incredibly personal for me because Third and Hayden is like a is a special place, like a real world place that like I learned about who I am, right? I learned about you know music, I learned about building. Like I played with Legos at this house. Like this house still stands today.

My grandmother still technically lives in that house in East Cleveland, Ohio. So to me, it was just a little bit more personal and kind of coming back to myself. Um, and I've just been very intentional just about like remaining super diverse with our with our roster, but also like supporting our artists where they're at, you know what I mean, not rushing the process, letting people you know go through their own growth changes and kind of come full circle with their own sounds and evolve and just really just being like a safe space for these artists. So let's shout out some of the artists on the roster just so people know who we who they can kind of look up and be like, oh shit, like she's got her hands in this diverse kind of you know range of talent. For sure. So Anastasia, uh she's LA Bay, she's incredible, very much like folk music. So I think like Joni Mitchell, yeah, uh Tracy Chapman, but like modern day. Fire. We just started working with Buddy, rapper Buddy. Really? Yeah. No, yeah, myself and Natalie Prosper and Matt, uh, Matt's his day-to-day, who's incredible. You know, we had a meeting like three or four months ago, and I was like, yo, I've always been a fan, and I've just been wanting you to see, you know, see you do more.

And I was just really, you know, honored to be you know, brought to the table with them, and it's like, yo, let's just work. Such a talented artist and one of the best personalities. Yeah, yes. He's such a character. You can't help such a character, And not afraid to show it, which is yeah, some people are characters, but they don't like sharing. Yeah, and he's very nice, and his his artist community is like very supportive and very vast. Like, I don't think there's a single artist in LA that doesn't know who Buddy is. Every big artist fucks a buddy, big and small, honestly. But it's like your favorite artist's favorite artist kind of character. 1000%. Yeah, okay. Uh Ben Riley, who you guys obviously know. Shout out to Ben Riley. We've heard of him. One of my favorite artists still to this day. Love that. He's constant rotation. Yes. I mean, Let the Sample Work is probably like one of my favorite songs. No, he's very special. Yes. I honestly feel like he's gonna be one of those greatest rappers of all time. Conversation. It's nice to see people very sleep on him in this current moment because I already see it. Like I see it all the way through when he's like 60, like how important he's going to be. Yes.

So I'm very excited about him. And then Jordan Hawkins. Uh I think John Mayer, Prince, Lenny Kravitz, and one ball of a beautiful tall black man. from North Carolina. he's unique, man. He's special. Yeah. This next album is incredible. I'm trying to put my put my finger on like what he's got going on. It's his own thing. Yeah, it is. Like it's something I've never seen before. Like the look, the music, all of it. Kind of everything. I feel like a lot of our artists are that though. They're very unique and not there's not much you can compare to them, which I enjoy that. Like it's a challenge for sure. It's very much uphill battle and getting people to see the vision because some people are visionless, if we're being honest. They like just take a little bit longer to get on the bandwagon. But I would also think that's the way to do it in modern day. Like, there's not a lot of artists that are just the new version of an older artist these days. It's like they are starting some type of new wave or some lane or combining lanes or some, you know, there's something special about everyone that's gotten, you know, up through there, I feel like. So yeah, like what challenges do exist with that?

Um because it would be way easier in some ways, I assume, to, you know, pick talent that is a little more like easily understood. Yeah, people can reference some other things. You know, which playlist to pitch them to. Yeah, they should they should open for this exact artist on tour because that's what they do. It's very cookie cutter and figured out already. Sure. So, like, how do you how are you approaching this type of diverse range of talent then? Like, I'm at this space of just like I've actually always been like this. I make people come to us. You know, we're not gonna overwork ourselves to get in front of you necessarily or make you accept us, but I feel like everything kind of has its timing and it'll just get there when it gets there. I think a lot of it is just strong marketing and strong product, like every single artist has incredible bodies of work that are gonna be marketed as such, not just hey, check out this one song and then put it on your playlist and then go dance to it on TikTok. Like none of our artists are that. And when you said like there's not a lot of artists that are like like I guess like future versions of things we've heard before, like a Joni Mitchell, like I really do believe every artist on our roster is very much a legacy act.

Yeah. Um these are the future Jay-Zs, these are the future whatever, like fill in the blank. I think these are those artists. So I think that we're just taking a very intentional specific approach to like, okay, this is this artist, and this is how we're gonna market that, and people are either gonna love it or not. But it's gonna take longer. 1000%. How are those conversations going? Because we live in in a in a day and age where like, just getting gratification, bro, if if I'm an artist and I'm not I if I'm not up tomorrow, I want to quit borderline, right? And I mean, shit, we have the same issues, like you know, growing a podcast for the last three years, it's like, man, this shit is it's a it's a grind, and like you really gotta stay down and like believe in the in the long term vision. Yeah, because you do see overnight successes happening, and you know, it it's tough not to look. It's discouraging. Yeah, yeah, 1000 percent do you think those overnight successes is are actually detrimental, maybe to some of them? Like, can you come up too fast?

Oh, 1000%. It can hurt you, right? Yeah, fast money goes faster. Yeah, just ask a stripper. They never have they never have money, no disrespect. Yeah. Do your artists struggle with the like patients. Yeah, 1000%. How do though, you know what I mean? Like if someone's out there struggling with like, fuck, I haven't made it, and it's been X, Y, Z amount of time. Yeah. What what kind of conversation would you have with that artist? I mean, it's honestly just a lot of honest reassurance and honesty, right? With them. and say, yo, this is you're the underdog. Like, and I'm the underdog. That's why we work together. And so just uh kind of just reassuring them, like, yo, we're on the right path. Look at where you were last year, look at where you were three months ago. That's improvement, right? My my motto since the I think the very beginning of my music career has been a fan a day. You can't worry about every single body all over the world in the first day of your in the first two years of your career. It's gotta it's gonna take time to reach masses and masses of people. And so I just give people a lot of reassurance and like tell them to take their time and kind of go inward.

And I think I'm really thankful now to work with artists that are very self-aware who also understand like, yeah, I am different. This is gonna take longer. I'm tripping. And they kind of real, they kind of get themselves back on track, you know. So, it's checks and balances. The milestone thing, I think, is huge. They're talking about like reminding people like growth. Yeah, you you've done this, this is where you were last month. You are. We never do it. Just checking in. We never look at like really where we've come from. You guys have come a long way. We have. No, we have like even just hearing you say that, I was like, fuck, where were we one year ago? Not here, not shit. You know what I mean? Like compared to where we are today. Definitely free Drake. Free Drake, bro. Everything's free, Drake. Before no, it's BD and AD. Yeah. It's BD and AD, bro, before Drake and after Drake. Yeah, that's crazy. Oh, but to finish your question, also on the roster. Yes, please. Because I don't want to. Key, Fat Man Key. Come on. Yeah. Another podcast alumni waiting. For that one. Uh Zaya Bell.

Yes. Um, and producer Jay James. Okay. Yes. And we've been working with this. producer. Is that your first producer? Not really. Okay. I used to work with uh Pyrex and Chase the Money. No, but I mean Third and Hayden. Yes. Yes. Yes. Okay. Jay James has kind of been down for like the last three years, just kind of patiently waiting his moment. But we've been, yeah, he's the first producer. in the squad. Nice. Yeah. Hell yeah. No, that's a everyone go check out all of those. Um, do you think that you're like anti-label, anti-establishment? I am not anti-label. Uh I am anti-selling yourself short or giving away too many of your rights before it even makes sense to give away anything. You know, when I've worked with previous clients, we were very, very specific in achieving certain things on our own, right? Gold records, tours, radio play. Like there were our our own milestones, freshman covers that we wanted to do before we even entertained very many conversations.

Cause granted we did have conversations super early, and that's really just like get you on the radar kind of conversations. Like, hey, let's go to New York way before it even makes sense. Uh after the slaughter tape of 21 Savage. Let's go up and meet Lyor and Todd and just so they can know you. And every single one of those guys told me, no, he's not a star. He's he's it's a little too dangerous. Like literally. And I hang on, hang on. No, Todd and Lyor are like they're still friends of mine. Like these are people that like Todd Moscowitz, Lyor, and Kevin Lyles. All passed. All passed. Like hard pass. Hard pass. Like, nah, that ain't it. That ain't it. Like it's he's too dangerous. He'll never be able to do, you know, mainstream things and I was like okay cool it's no big deal how how I'm just anti just selling like yeah that wasn't the time that was like hey check this guy out I think he's dope I'm working with him you know we're putting out tapes we're working with Sonny we're you know he has a relationship with Metro we're gonna do a tape with him you know just like kind of planting the seeds but it wasn't the time you know so when when three goats of the music industry basically say that ain't it about your artists you gotta be fucking confident how do you move forward I would be like all right 21 sorry like I'm gonna go find someone else that Lyor, Kevin and Todd are a fan of right right you know what I mean like what is this unwavering faith in yourself like you do like when you told me you were quitting your job to do your podcast full time and you already had kids I was like oh he's crazy like he's a madman but you have to have that level belief not only in yourself but in what you're building and I really fully believed in everything that that that was like I really felt like no this this person is special he's gonna be a front row at Tom Ford and St. Laurent shows he's gonna walk in these things like he's gonna do these things it's a beautiful band and he's making unique music I believed in him as much as I believed in myself yeah you know and that you can't can't do anything other than that is believe and say faith is the strongest thing you can have so you're not anti label though no no not at all yeah so it's just I'm anti bad partnerships yes right and there's a lot of them out there the anti-predatory deals.

Yeah. I'm anti-artists signing seven album deals yeah so okay, okay, but but here's the devil's advocate that a lot of people like to play. When when these bad deals come up, right? Where are the attorneys? Attorneys are the worst people on the planet. Speak on it, Key. Like they'll lie through their teeth for you, and that's not a good person. Yeah. Um, that's somebody that's on your side, and that's great, but that doesn't mean that they're a good person. I think a lot of lawyers, and I won't say all are bad. My lawyer actually is in the process of unlawyering. Like she's going full into life coaching because she's just like the music business is a shit show. Oh. And I can't fix it by myself. So I'm gonna work on this side of the on this side of the fence. Obviously, with the lawyer brain a bit in the back where I'm still thinking a bit like a lawyer, but current lawyers are are don't necessarily always have the best interest of the client in mind. It's a lot of, you know, let's make some money. Let me get a kickback.

I know lawyers that get kickbacks from labels. Wow. If their cli if their clients knew that, they'd be fired immediately. Wow. That's true. that's kind of an interesting one. I hate to interrupt this episode, but guys, I got one thing on the mind right now, and it's data. I can't stop thinking about it. All the artists in 2024 are winning because of data. They know who their fans are, they have access to their fans. Do you? Spotify's not telling you who your fans are. Apple Music ain't telling you who your fans are. But our friends over at DistroKid created a feature called HyperFollow. Every single release, you can set up a pre-save campaign with a hyper follow and get access to every single fan's email address. Now you can let them know when you have a show coming up, when you're dropping exclusive merch, when you're going live. And without the data, you're just bound by the algorithms of TikTok, Instagram, YouTube. No more relying on those platforms. We're going straight to our fans. DistroKid is the best DIY distributor. You can upload unlimited music for a ridiculously low rate. And you're gonna have access to features like HyperFollow. omtdistro.com, you're gonna get 30% off when you sign up for DistroKid, and you can start collecting your fans'

data today. Henry, let's get back into it. So, you know, Brent Faiyaz has his reasons, right? Of why stay independent. Okay. And I think you're a huge fan of Ty, you know, him and him and uh his business partner, I guess, is probably the best term for Ty Baisden. Baisden. in, right? Yes. Yeah, yeah. So, you know, him and Brent Faiyaz have built obviously an incredible uh company together, centered around Brent as the artist, uh, really like the kind of flagship independent story, right? Why do you think an artist should or should not stay independent? Because I think we love to throw the term independent, like I'm independent. Like I love being independent. I'm stressed. Yeah, exactly. Like, what should an artist know about being independent? It's expensive. Yeah, It's a great start. Yeah, it's very, very expensive. Yeah, I can't really tell people whether or not they should be indie or not indie. But what should they know about being indie?

For me, it's like you you have this giant, you need this giant team of people producer, engineer, manager, tour manager, all this giant roster of people. And you pay all of them. You pay, you're the one paying them in the least profitable, like three tenths of a penny industry that you're living in. Yeah, streaming has been a blessing and a curse for the music business. The the top that are at the top now are you know, they made it past a certain point where they can be at the top, but it's it's harder than ever to be one of those success stories. But but yeah, so it's it's expensive as fuck. It's expensive. Yep, it can become stressful. I mean, being an entrepreneur in general is stressful, right? Because sometimes, you know, you'll have one month where it's like, oh man, we we killed it. We made five, six figures, but then it might be seven or eight months before you see another significant amount of money until you get to a Brent Faiyaz phase, right? Or stage where you you're seeing consistent cash flow coming in and you're able to like, all right, let me get into investments. Okay, let me buy a home, let me do all of these things, but it's very, very expensive and it can be stressful.

I think having a good business partner like a Ty basin who is in incredibly smart before he was working with Brent, he was very, very smart. And so getting with somebody that is a business minded person that sees the the vision and says, Okay, we can do this, but we can do this in fashion, we can do this in touring. Let's pay for our own tours instead of you know doing it the other way, like takes a lot of vision and thought. And if you don't have vision, I don't suggest being independent. I think you should just sign to a label. Yeah. Yeah. And but even if you sign to a label or not, like how important do you think it is for artists to treat themselves as companies? Oh, you have to. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. You have to treat yourself as a company. Yeah. From the bottom up, right? From the branding elements, from the staffing uh side of things. Like you have to think of yourself as a business. But that's what I think. How many of these artists have that business mindset? I feel like not most of them, they're so good at the creativity in being in the studio and making the art, and this whole other side is required. Okay, so I think there's more and more artists though that are becoming very aware in that way, though, business minded.

Um, because they're, they're having to. They're not having a lot of people get involved from very early, like, you know, attorneys or managers or whatever. They it might just be them and a creative team, you know, but they're having to figure it out because out of necessity, right? So it's like a survival of the fittest kind of thing. Do you think your artist, you know, what I mean? Like, like obviously, I know you bring a lot of that business savvy, like to the equation here. Sure. Does your whole roster, for example, operate with that like very entrepreneurial mindset? Yes. Okay. Well, so is that kind of like a one of my requirements? That's a prerequisite. Yeah, 1000%. Yeah, like we we just can't. We can't even talk. Yeah. If you don't understand that this is your company. Yeah. Like, what are we doing? And that I'm, you know, I'm a co-owner in this company that we're doing together. Right. And in some instances, I just manage your business that you built. Sure. Right? Cause me and Ben are business partners. Sure. Like we have the Ty Baisden and Brent Faiyaz set up, But there are other clients that I just manage your business that you're, you know, that's coming in or that I'm going out to proactively seek for you. And that's a different setup.

There's no equity involved in that. So that's a certain level of, you know, work. Why would an artist bring in a business partner versus a manager? I think it definitely takes the right kind of artist understanding where they're trying to go. So the vision part is super important. The person that's bringing in a business partner is very independent mindset, like from the very beginning. They're not someone that enjoys, you know, having a boss. Like they want to do things their own way. They're creative, like, their creativity cannot be compromised. That's somebody I think it's like, yo, you got to bring in a business partner. Obviously, Chris Clancy and Tyler have probably worked in a more manager artist capacity, but I'm sure at some point in their careers they've worked together as business partners on certain projects, right? Because they they see, okay, this you're a businessman, so I'm gonna meet you at businessman level or woman, obviously. Sure. So I think it's I think it is a lot of self awareness and vision and knowing what the end goal is, knowing that you're like a a slow, a slow roll. like you're not an instant turn up, like you're not just getting on TikTok and then you blow up, you're not a viral artist, like understanding that this might take seven years, and that's gonna take a business partner because the label's not giving you seven years of time to develop. We want that oven money, not that microwave money.

Correct. You want grandma's gumbo, you don't want a hot pocket. Hot pockets be hitting though, bro. I'm just saying. Until you burn my mouth. Until you burn your tongue. Until you've lit your mouth. Permanent tongue damage thanks to hot pockets and pizza rolls, swear to God. Um, so speaking of kind of like viral TikTok sensations, right? If I'm starting a label, there's a good argument for like, fuck it, I'm signing the next big TikTok or like you know, the next big TikTok smash. Like, why not? Um, like, do you think there's a trend towards consumers wanting like music that isn't just TikTok hits, or like where do you feel the state of the music business is for like us listeners? People want more substantive music and music that mirrors the times, right? We're hearing a lot of that talk around like you know, music should show what's going on in the world. And I think this next generation of kids is they're very, very smart, they're very, very self-aware. Um they know that our world is like slowly deteriorating, there's wars happening, there's genocide happening, there's a growing level of hate for other people that is just like grown disgusting, and people want to hear music that takes them out of that, but then also speaks to that and says, Hey, everything's not good, like shit's going down in other parts of the world.

So listen to this, listen to Anastasia, someone that makes you go inward and kind of center yourself, right? Or listen to Ben who's speaking about some of these, you know, racist matters or whatever. Like they're speaking to what's going on in the world. So I do think currently in today's time, like people want more depth, more substance. That's what the whole beef is with Kendrick and Drake. It's not about who's better, it's about who's lived more, who's like done a little bit more soul searching and is willing to connect more with people rather than just you know, provide cool songs to dance to. I was kind of reading through the lines on some of your tweets. You don't seem like a a Drake. You seem like you're siding with Kendrick big time. And then she was like, if your favorite artist is Drake, we can't even talk. That's literally what one of her tweets said. No, I think I said unfollow me. Oh, we just have nothing in common. Okay. And I used I used to really like Drake. Like when we were the same age, and like, and then it just stopped evolving. You know, it stopped growing.

I stopped hearing things that I connected with. So and Drake's not a bad artist. Like he resonates obviously with a lot of people, but I just want more. That's just where I'm at. Yeah. And everybody's not at that level. They just maybe they just won't turn up because they're about to head out or because they're about to go to, you know, a college party or they're about to go, you know, to a bachelorette party or whatever, and they want to listen to Drake. Cool. But then if I want to like really, really sit with myself and evaluate and reflect, I'm not listening to Drake. I'm listening to Kendrick. See, and this is where I think you're not even saying this, but more where my mind goes immediately is this is where you have to understand like who you're making music for. Yeah, 1000%. Yeah, you know, because but I think Drake's very aware of who he's making music. Yeah, he knows. He's too smart to not. Exactly. But I'm thinking our audience maybe could use like some reflection around like who are they making music for, right? Because I think the the quicker you can like come to terms with who exactly you're making music for and like what settings your music should be played in, right? It's huge.

It's like the quicker you can just further go deeper into that world that you're building. 100%. That's marketing one on one is knowing who you're speaking to. Yeah. Who's buying, who's consuming my music, yeah, my product or my brand. How do you find that out as an artist? I think it takes a little bit of trial and error initially, like when you're an upstart artist and figuring out who your people are. Kind of like existing as a as a human is growing through life. Like it takes a while to find your people, right? So kind of getting music out there and seeing who resonates with it, who's DMing you, like, yo, I really love this song. It makes me feel like this. Or I listen to this when I'm going through it. I love thank you for making this album. Like those are your people, and you find them, and then without stalking them, obviously, you kind of get a sense of like, oh, this is where this fan shops. This is, you know, the kind of movies this fan likes. Oh, I like those kind of movies. What a coincidence. So I think what you end up finding when you start putting music out is like you're finding the your people because they're like you, right? They connect with your story, they connect with your narrative.

They want to be your friend if they ever had the opportunity to be. And so I think that's how you find your fans. I I literally made a video about stalking, Basically stalking your fans. Yeah. And like it's not a literal thing either, guys. So like back to show up at their house. But it was like you go look at their profile. Give them a look. Yeah. What are these people like? Like you'd think Nike's not taking a look at you know what college athletes are are wearing and how they're showing up and how high school athletes are showing up. They're diff they're taking a look at their their audience to better improve their product. Of course. If you're a business, you have to do that. Yeah, absolutely. So is there such a thing as a TikTok artist in your mind? Um I don't know. I think that's I don't want to disrespect anybody. No. Yeah, because like I and I kind of agree, man. Like at this point, let's look in. Let's fucking, there's an artist that maybe found a bulk of their marketing success on TikTok. But that just means that they have a certain demographic that likes their music that also happens to like using TikTok. Right.

I don't think that that has anything to do with what are you an Instagram artist? Yeah. You a fucking YouTube artist. I don't know that that's really are you a Spotify artist? Like because if that's the case, you would call La Russell an Instagram artist. Right. Like he built a lot of his base for taking his you know backyard parties onto Instagram. Yeah. And then doing content and repeat, step and repeat, but he's not an Instagram artist. No. But we do have like SoundCloud rappers. That's kind of a thing. Don't get me started on the SoundCloud. Oh yeah. Well, now I'm kind of interested on your high level. Like, no, we're not, we're not opening the SoundCloud door, Henry. Soundcloud. He doesn't know he doesn't know what that means. He doesn't know. He doesn't know. I want to know now. I don't think we want to know. No one wants to know. No, no, no. Okay. So, you know, we talked about marketing one-on-one. Let's let's get a little bit into just like you've got a roster of artists, right? Sorry, Henry. We're not going there. We're talking about this after this episode. That's fine. I mean, if you want to comment on it, I don't I'm learning to be professional then politically correct. I'll tweet about it at some point.

Just follow her on Twitter, Henry, and you'll at Kels Stories for more on SoundCloud. K-E-L-S. Okay, so you know, you kind of talk you know, talked about marketing one-on-one. I do want to just unpack a little bit of like the marketing strategy that you have in place for your artists, right? Because um, what tactics are you employing to really like find fans, nurture fans, build communities, etcetera? Like how are you approaching that? Every single artist is for sure different and has their own strategy. I tend to lean into where the artist wants to go and kind of follow their lead and kind of just be like additive or added value to what they're already wanting to do. Sure. Um I'm not a big fan of making an artist do something because I think that I'm right, because I don't think that anyone right now has the answers. So a lot of it's been trying different approaches. Like for Ben Riley, for example, he's very anti-social media, loves Twitter, but like he's not posting all day. He's not getting on TikTok all day.

He will get on Discord and have conversations with his fans. I think, you know, a lot of what he's finding success in is like what we were just talking about, is finding his tribe. So he tweets about, you know, Spider-Man, the new movies and the games, and then he's finding his fan through that, right? And so I think it's a lot of like just being who you are is like guiding the marketing strategy, and then finding ways to amplify it online without taking away from the art, if that makes sense. I feel like the hardest part for some of the artists I know is like almost just being completely self-aware and even who am I. I think being self-aware is the the biggest and best thing anybody in the music business can do. Not only artists, but uh executives as well. Yeah. Yeah. What are you good at? What are you not good at? Yeah, and know that and understand that and then be good with that. Yeah. You know, and then find your people that are good at that thing that you really suck at. How do you uh approach like the IRL stuff versus the digital marketing? Because in my mind, we talk about this all the time of how important those things are, especially if you live in a city that can be activated. For sure.

Right. Like if you're in the middle of nowhere and it doesn't have the music scene that you, you know, want and your fans just aren't there, sure. I empathize with you. I get it, right? But like if you're in a a major market where there's fans that exist like that will like your music, I do. Do you feel like there has to be some parts in real life, and then there has to obviously be like the digital marketing side of things. Definitely. I'm very like old school and analog, pro-analog. I'm pro-word of mouth, in-person IRL. So what does that mean though? You know what I mean? Like in practice, what in practice? It honestly looks like, you know, how many people can you get in a room that are already fans of yours, maybe from digital. You've and you've identified them from social media or through your newsletter or through your Discord, and then you do a meetup and 10 people show up. All right, that's your core. So the next time your goal should be can we get 20 people to show up to this one thing, whether it's a movie night or game night, whatever it is. Like it doesn't have to be always so overthought. I think that a lot of artists and creatives, like because we're all creative, we get in our way by overthinking the thing too much.

But knowing that, like, oh, it could just be 10 people watching the Spider-Man movie at this spot that allows us to play movies. Is it also ego that they want more than 10 people? Yes. A thousand percent because it looks embarrassing, right? Only a few people show up, but you have to build something for people to even show up to. Yeah. So the first time doing it, if you're expecting thousands and thousands of people to come, like you're quite honestly the Lulu. Um unless you've already been doing a thing for a a certain amount of time. I think like one of the the best marketing companies in the music business is LVRN. Yes, they have like super strived at taking things that are in real life and magnifying them on the internet. Yes. And it works every single time because they're they keep at it. They didn't just stop at the first one that only 50 kids showed up to. They keep at it and keep at it, keep at it. And that's like that's shown through in what they've been able to build. How much time should be spent making music versus marketing music? I don't know that there's like a a one size fits all for that question.

No. Yeah. I think it's definitely different per the artist. And then, yeah, just in how because you also want to train your fan on how to consume your music. If you're always putting things out. Well, like get them on your cadence rather than being on their cadence. Like just because they're asking for a new song doesn't even mean you have to put out a new song if you're not comfortable putting out a new song. Right. I think for whatever reason we've gotten to this like energy of like, well, when you're putting something out, it's like, yo, bro, I just put something out six months ago. Go check that out. But here's some marketing to support what I just put out six months ago. But I'm not ready to put out another project. I actually have to live life, go through some experiences before I put out an album, like a SZA does or a Kendrick, et cetera. Like they space out their albums because they've trained their fan to you know create that demand. You know what I mean? You gotta like let people miss you. I think we're just kind of concerned. about. Interesting. This is But I don't know that it applies to podcasts. No, no, no, no.

I mean, I'm not even thinking podcasts. I'm thinking just we talk about this all the time. We're concerned about the artists in our community who maybe spend a year working on a masterpiece album and then you know, post the cover art twice, market it for 10 days. There's that and then forget about it. Okay. But so let's use Ben. tragedy. Tragedy. Let's use Ben. So how long did y'all promote freelance? That was the first project, right? That was the first project. So he put it out in like summer, what 2022? Two, right? Yeah. Yeah. I got wind of it like maybe the month after he put it out through um Amir. Yep. Just started chatting with him. Didn't start working with him until January 2023. Sure. And he was promoting it still that he was still promoting it. Last six months. Yeah, he was still promoting it. And then did y'all continue to continue to what? Yeah. to work it? We did a little bit. Okay. But at some a certain point he got sick of it.

Yeah. Right? Because he's like that was many months after. Yeah, it was definitely many months after. Because then obviously the viral moment happened, and so that gave it some new steam, and a lot of people were discovering him. So during that discovery period, he's for sure promoting the hell out of his stuff. We were putting more music videos out to support the project and bring people back to it. Then we did a deal with AWOL. And then that gave us some more influx of cash to like keep pushing it and keep marketing it, doing shows. But yeah, we pushed it for a good, I don't know, uh after its drop, two years. Yeah. Yeah, because like just in my mind, right? If we're not releasing new music, I feel like we do need to be pushing catalog, though, right? I mean, I think we all got to do a better job of pushing catalog. It's such a cheat code. Yeah, yeah. Like with Key, for instance, like Fat Man Key. He has hits catalog that he's so many that are new to a billion five billion people, right? It's like some of my strategies, honestly, like, yo, what songs from this can we put on a compilation or what songs can we just shoot a video for?

Like Juvenile just shot a video for a song that's been out for 30 years. Fire. That's hard. That's amazing. Because a song could pop off on TikTok or wherever, because kids are like, wait, what? I've never heard this song. Yes. A song's not old until like honestly a billion streams, in my opinion. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Even then. Yeah. I was like, Beaver would say a million. There's so many people who old songs are popping off. If you believe in it, make it sh make it work. So, all right. So you mentioned obviously like 2020 when you were parting ways with since the 80s, right? Twenty twenty one. Okay, all right. Obviously, the pandemic was contributing to this, but then you know, clearly the situation with you know, since the 80s, you were clearly feeling, you know, unfulfilled and you wanted different things for yourself in you know in your life. Sure. Like what's been your mental health journey like in the music industry? Because you've been doing this a little while. Yeah. And you've, you know, obviously, you know, worked with Savage back in the day, and then clearly, you know, since the eighties and other things in between, right? You have a you know, very long story.

But what's been your you know, journey when it comes to like the mental side of this business? Well, for one, I didn't know that I needed to address mental health until a certain point. Like I had to hit almost complete rock bottom. Well, what did that look like for you? For me, that looked like, you know, people that were really close to me that love me saying, you know, I was unrecognizable in terms of like how I was showing up. I had a cli a really close friend of mine, you know, after losing a friend, a mutual friend of ours, come to me and be like, I don't think you know who you are. And I was like, What? What do you mean by that? Like what do you even mean by that? Right? And not even, you know, just com completely at a loss. Like, I don't know what you're talking about. Like, I know who I am, I'm key. I'm this Grammy winning manager, and you know, I'm doing this, I'm doing that, and yada yada yada yada. All these outside things, right? That like completed who I thought I was, right? It's like been five years of thinking and reflecting and therapy, um, that was like coming back to myself, which is what third and Hayden also is, right?

It's like coming full circle back to who I started as, 'cause as kids we were like very pure, we're very innocent, very untainted, right? Minus like the traumas and things that I get added on, you know, in years after being a young child. So in the last five years, I've just been doing a lot of that, a lot of soul searching and a lot of therapy. I think I was probably spent like maybe five figures in therapy. You know, I go every other week. Worth every dime though, huh? Oh yeah. She's very expensive, but very worth it. What do you think it is about the music business that I think we're just now at a point where we're starting to hear more conversations about mental health in music. I don't feel like historically it wasn't a thing. No. What about the music industry for creatives and then even executives? Do we think, you know what I mean? Like makes mental health such a thing right now? A prominent thing. I think it's a mix of things, right? I think it's the younger generations kind of showing us how important it is. Like there's a lot of younger people who prioritize mental health and and the self-work, the shadow work, taking days off like when I was coming up, taking a day off sounded insane.

Yeah. Like, are you crazy? Summer Fridays, what someone asked me about summer Fridays in our team calls like what is that? What? Um but we our generation, my generation in particular, I'm obviously a little older than y'all like we worked to the bone like because we had to because we thought we had to because we saw the people before us working their asses off. You know what I mean? So we thought we had to do that. And so you just you're not conscious of how much you're ignoring yourself and how much you're ignoring you know your your mental health and taking care of yourself and getting to know yourself getting to see what you don't like but who you do like a lot of our events are around open bars. There's a lot of drinking you do a lot of dumb things when you're wasted out of your mind four days a week, five days a week, because you're at these networking events. So I think just in the last few years, it's become so like at the forefront because a lot of us hit rock bottom, right? During the pandemic, in the middle of the pandemic, before the pandemic, where we're just like, we're washed, I'm tired, I'm exhausted.

Suicidal ideation became a bigger thing that you know our community is talking about. And we've seen Chris Lighty's and really big people like want to get out of here. And I think it's is a lot of it is the younger people being like, yo, that's not healthy. That's not cool to not know who you are. You know, it's not cool to not take a day off. Like we don't have to be working 24-7. We're actually not curing cancer, though I do think music is very healing. You can take a day off, and you should take a day off, right? Why do so many artists do you think struggle with mental health? Yeah. I mean, their entire job is almost being performative. And being performative is like it's very detrimental to your spirit and your soul, if you let it be, right? I'm always having to show up for other people, always, you know, you can't repeat outfits, and you gotta be fresh, and are you attractive? Are you too heavy?

Like it's a lot of self-con, like it makes you very self-conscious, I think, to be an artist and to be always on display. Like imagine someone just always watching you like the Truman show. You know, like that can be very deteriorating to who you are as a human being. But I think there's a lot of artists who do a great job and not letting him not not letting it take them under. Or even if they did let him take it under, take them under, they talked about it. You know, Kendrick talked about you know his therapy journey, which is why you know I I resonate and connect with with his journey. Drake has not told me anything about his back to her hating Drake. You don't hate Drake. Full circle. This entire episode is about my hatred. She doesn't fuck with you, bro. That's not true. Cue the BBL Drizzy. I just want to hear what he's talking about in therapy. That's it. He's definitely doing it. Because we're the same age. You gotta be going through something. Yeah. The money's not fixing everything. No, it's so true. I'd love to see like labels have in-house therapists. Well, our deals come with mental health funds.

Love that as a label. That's awesome. That's amazing. Yeah. And that's something that it didn't. It actually happened after Jordan, so Jordan's deal might be the only one that doesn't have that. So he got screwed. He got fucked. Yeah. Sorry, Jordan. Talk about fucking artists out of their deals. I mean, where are my mental health benefits key. It's a brand new thing. Jordan, we got you. You can sign to the one more time podcast records. We give you full mental health benefits. You can be our first artist. We'd love to poach you from Jordan. We go to White Man. Oh, God. And now it turned racial. And now it's racist. Wow. We are in Georgia. Okay. It's true. Well, Atlanta. though. Make that a clip. Yeah. No, we're in Stone Mountain. Where are we at? That is this is Stone Mountain. This is the heart of racism. There's literally racist people on statues like two minutes away from here. You got confederate generals carved into granite. Yeah, you can hike with the racists. It's like come to Georgia. Who doesn't love a good hike with a racist? I mean, truly. If I'm hiking with anybody, Stone Mountain High School.

It's Stonewall Jackson, bro. What about Stone Mountain High School, though? That's that's a little different. It's diverse. We're diverse. Sure. I mean, anyway. Jordan, we're gonna add a health care. Yeah, let's fix this this episode. And Zaya. I didn't add one in Zaya's now that I can do it. Wow. I'm tripping. You are a terrible label owner. I'm a terrible label executive. Yes, you are. But okay, so all right, so you guys have that. And so, do you know, do you see other labels following suit at all? Or we've asked, you know, different artists, either whether it be a distribution deal or like a boutique indie, you know. We've asked for, you know, can we take advantage of health insurance benefits? Because even just both basic health insurance, uh it doesn't necessarily have to be specific to mental health, but just having health insurance is such a big weight off an artist's shoulders. We were denied both times that we asked about those benefits. Um, which is unfortunate. But I I think, you know, there are other resources like music cares and other organizations that are like, hey, we're here for artists that cannot afford this, that and the third, and then you know, making themselves available. But I'd like to see it become a trend.

I think, you know, Shanti Das in the silence of shame initiative is is, you know, taking on the lead in terms of like, hey, you need to offer this, you need to be speaking to your artists about this, you need to make this available. So I think we're coming along, like it's happening slowly, but surely I think at some point it'll be become the norm. It needs to. So are there organizations that where like independent artists can get health insurance through? I don't know if it's full on health insurance. I don't know how it full on works. I gotta do my own research. Okay, maybe we should that could be a cool like yeah, topic, you know what I mean? Just try and find some, yeah. If any industry needs it, bro. Man, we need it the most. No, for real. So, you know, other than kind of like ramping up the benefits that like an artist might have, are there any other just like blatant like flaws that you see that like could be easily changed, right? Because I I think there's like some systemic things, right, within the music business, but like what are just like a few quick wins that you're like, how the fuck have we not done this? You know, is there anything that you've been just thinking about and you're like, I don't see why we can't change this?

I'd like for companies to stop saying they're artists first when they're not. What does artist first mean to you? Artists first to me actually means prioritizing the needs of the artist. In practice. I'm an artist. I sign a deal with your company in third and Hayden. Third and Hayden wants to see me, you know, have XYZ budget and it'd be spent this particular way. You as the big entity is like, okay, cool. That sounds great. We're artists first, yada yada yada. And then, you know, a year from now, it's like, oh yeah, we're actually just gonna pivot. We're actually not gonna do that thing anymore. Best of luck. Follow-through. Just some follow-through. And then if you're not getting it right, finding out why you're not getting it right instead of just being like, hey, this isn't working. Um I can only really speak from my own personal experience because as a JV or as a smaller label, I partner with sometimes bigger companies, and they want to be artists first and they want to be, hey, we're artists aligned, but then their deals don't necessarily look like that. Um so that's in practice, right?

Your deals should actually be friendly and not predatory and not only benefit you, right? As the big guy in the in the equation. Yeah. Um, it should benefit all parties to some degree. And obviously, I probably sound very anti-business. Maybe that's why I'm not a millionaire yet, but I think if we can just create a more equitable, like terms for people, I think that you know, everybody can be happy. Yeah. Artists first, baby. That's right. Henry, yeah. We've entered a final segment of the podcast with our friend Key Opens Doors. He's a great host. Thank you. Thank you so much. We've done this for 200 and something episodes. You're episode 200 and something now. Yeah, at this point we're on the trees. I don't have a number, I'm just 200 something. We two oh we don't know. We don't know. I'm gonna say 203. Where we have internals and all these things. We're trying to Look at what's going on. But for now, this is the rapid fire rampage key. Oh no, I have to like think fast. Tell us more, Henry. Rapid fire. Oh, man. Tell us more.

I hate these kinds of things. These are gonna be kinda quick based things. There's three parts too. K. We're just gonna start with some short answer questions. Ease into it real nice. You're not gonna ease. Starting with. What did you have for lunch today? Oh, I had an egg and cheese croissant and some hashies. Oh, shit. Lots of carbs. Breakfast for lunch is fire. Sounds delicious to me. Amazing. Okay. Have you seen the XXL freshman that got released today? Have I? Oh God. Additional thoughts. Are there any artists that you would have put there, maybe instead of who they put on there? General reactions to the freshman. Instead of? I can't, I can't think of any instead ofs. Who would you have Who would you like to honorable mention, maybe? Anycia, I think had a great year. Yes. Um, you know, this is kind of a weird answer. Sure. And it might be too late. But Tierra Whack, I don't know. Was she ever a freshman?

I think she might have been. Like back in the day. I think she was actually at one point. Might have. I feel like she was. Am I the worst Tierra Whack fan on the planet? You might be, but I don't think that's like required to be a Tierra Whack. fan. No one really cares about the freshmen like they used to. I wouldn't say that. I think we all care. Like we used to, though. I mean not like we used to in there. 2019. Yeah. She was on the year after 21 Savage. Yes. You're lying. That sounds right to me. I don't know. 2019 XXL Freshman interview. My bad T. That's my bad. I was doing a lot in 2019. You just showed love to her, so I don't think that's your bad. Well, yeah, that that's who came to mind. Yeah. I think now would have been a better timing because her album was great. Yeah. I don't think enough people heard it and are talking about it. Um she's so creative too in her like rollouts and how she does structures. One of the best rollouts I've ever seen. Yes. So good. All right, Key, you have just signed an artist that has an insanely impressive catalog of unreleased music. You are blown away.

But no released music, no fan base, no social media, and no money. But you are like, this is your favorite artist of all time. What are the first steps? And for some reason you sign them. What are the first steps? It's actually not far-fetched. That unwavering self-belief or vision, you know? Believe all the way. She's got the vision, bro. This is your person. Locked in. What are the first steps we're taking with this artist? Um, the first steps were establishing a brand. Like what do we look like? Um, how do people come to like us? Like, what is our iconography? What's our logo? What are our colors, our fonts, like all of the things that seem kind of unimportant, um, that are actually very like foundational to setting up a brand, I think are where I like to start. Maybe some artists aren't exact as excited about that piece of it, but I think the right artists know that how important it is. Your dog can now speak English, but you must choose an accent for it to speak in. She's definitely giving us a little cajun.

Yeah, he's from New Orleans. Dinner time, baby. Yeah, baby. You hear me? Where do we have food, y'all? Why do you sound so Cajun? I like that accent. That was wild. I mean, top three accents in the world. Yeah, I mean, and Lil Wayne's my favorite artist. Apparently. He's the best. He's great. Yeah. Um, I'm interested in if you would ever sign an AI artist. Oh. What's your AI stance? What if you have an AI artist that's popping? Bringing in, just rolling in the money. Just crushed her soul. I love it. I love it. You just stomped on her heart, bro. We got an AI influencer that people are in love with. People are streaming the shit out of this artist. And you can sign them. The money is rolling in. God. And they don't have human problems. They'll never not feel like that. There's no mental health, there's no mental health issue. You don't need the mental health fund. You don't need any mental health benefits at all. No therapy.

Yeah. Uh am I signing them? The AI? Yes. You gotta sign it. No. I cannot morally stand next to that. Like if I don't really genuinely have a passion for your thing. What if you did? Like, I like the AI music? How? How would I like the AI music? Yeah. Do you like a cartoon character really resonated with you growing up? Same similar. Bugs Bunny, Roger Rabbit. Imagine Bugs. That was kind of a good drop. That's a good analogy. That was a bar, bro. Bugs drops. Have you said that before? We can. We've never like asked this exactly, but no, but like have you talked to someone about AI being AI music being like cartoon-generated? Right now? Character? Yeah. Oh wow. What if Bugs dropped like a cr the album of the year? We did love cartoons as if they were real people. I had a crush on fucking Lola from Space Jam. Yeah, Lola Bunny. For sure. That makes sense. Yeah. Did you ever know Jessica Rabbit? Yeah.

Roger Rabbit. Of course. She's smoking it. Yeah. I'm really trying to unpack what she just did, though. That makes sense. Yeah. Okay. No. Excuse me. No, that makes sense. You said it really weird. I mean, you also said I clearly don't have a filter. That was just all right. All right, but so do we just kind of make you come around to the AI thing? Ah. Still no? I think it's still a no. Okay. Hard pass. I'm old, bro. Like I'm not AIing things. How do I A and R AI? I think you gotta learn. I think that's keeping up the time. I think you're just I think that's just marketing. I think you could do it. Yeah. I mean, maybe I'll come around and feel differently, but in this current moment on episode 200 something. That's great. You've just been elected supreme overlord of the music industry. Am I not that? In our minds. What's the first thing that you change? I mean, we gotta pay more people. We gotta pay people more on Spotify. That's it. That's it. That's the first thing.

First big step. Streaming in general, though, not just Spotify, but all streaming, we have to pay them more. We gotta figure it out. Yeah. There's gotta be a way. Key, if you were an emoji, what emoji would you be? Right now, my favorite emoji is the one that's like, he's like blowing smoke. Yeah. He's like, whew. Yeah. Well, I'm thinking that one right now. Because it could be multiple things. It could be like, that's fire. Or it could be like, I'm exhausted. Or it could be like Right. Because I'm often that. I'm exhausted. It's versatile. Yeah. What we've learned about Key on this episode is she's tired. I'm so tired. She's a tired black woman. Don't fucking mess with it. We are in Stone Mountain. Wow, man. Apparently, white people can't say the word black before woman. You can't say tired black woman. It's actually like saying the N-word. Oh, man. it's pretty much the same thing. You're gonna have to bleep that now. Music podcaster basically says N-word. It's gonna be the catch y'all canceled. Episode 200 something.

It was about time. We went up in flames. And it was the TBW. Yeah. It's going to be a clue that we post. I'm not saying it again. Exactly. Don't say it again. Let's move the fuck on really fast. I've learned my lesson. Key, what is your favorite curse word? Shit. Shit. Mine too. I love it. That was a perfect segue into that. That was part one. It's pretty much like shit. Get this over with. We are. We're going right into part two. This is the this or that. I'm gonna give you two choices. Okay. Just have to pick one. Starting with. Don't do anything with TBW. You know what I am gonna do is mute your mic right now. So how's that sound? Wow. Starting with. I'll put him back in here in a second on good behavior. Hooks or verses? Verses. Third verse or bridge? Bridge. Singles or albums. Albums. Hard work or talent? Hard work. Rich or happy? Happy. Bowling or tennis? Ooh.

Mmm. Tennis. Hot or lemon pepper. I actually don't eat chicken anymore. Oh. I know. Well, it could be hotter lemon pepper, not chicken. Chicken? That's what they did. Lemon pepper. Can't believe it's not chicken or whatever. The uh impossible chicken. Impossible chicken. Sports car SUV. SUV. Silly socks or silly hats? Hats. And finally become a full-time rapper or leave the music industry. Oh wow. Leave the music industry. What a sad oh wow. Okay, yeah, she's gone. Did you never have any like aspirations? I used to rap. Oh not ever professionally. Can we find it on? You know, I used to write raps, like in a notebook. Everyone wrote raps. Yeah, we wrote raps. I wrote raps. Sure. I mean, we... That's fair. Yeah. Were they Eminem-ish? That's racist, bruh. Okay. Okay, was it Post Malone-ish? Ooh. That's racist. Is it appropriation-ish? Oh god.

Getting you guys straight clips for this episode. Getting shots fired from my white co-host is insane, bro. How is my white co-host calling me? I stand with ...an appropriator? Sorry, I stand with Kei. Henry's smart. Yeah. Smart. I don't stand with either of you. We are moving to the final section. This is the word association. This is where it gets real dangerous. Okay. I'm gonna say one word, and you have to give me immediately the first word. The craze of mine off the top. That's right. Here we go. Don't think about it. There's no correct answers. You're only judged on speed. Starting with music. Love. Caffeine. Hate. Swag. Ew. Content. Ugh. SpongeBob. Love. Jet ski. Sorry. I have a friend that crashed a jet ski into a boat. Oh shit. So I couldn't think of a word. It was just that image. Yeah. No, that's a great answer. who was that?

Uh his name is BJ. I think he's he's an A&R. Was that the Was that like one that went viral? Yes. Yeah, wait. You saw that? Who was he with? Was he with some famous rapper? No, he was with Brandon Farmer. Okay, so I just saw I saw it from Brandon's page. That's instantly what I thought of. It's the funniest thing I've ever... That was the funniest thing I've ever seen. It's literally the best thing I've ever. Who does that in real life? Just straight up into a yacht. Yeah. We'll try and find the clip and put it right there. Dude, I'll find it. It's So good. Okay. Spinach. Yum. Viral. Ew. Legend. Jay-Z. 3 a.m. Good time to work. That's not one word. No, no, that a phrase is cool, and I agree. OnlyFans. Hmm. I don't know if I have a word for that. NLE, uh, NLE Chapa. What? Lil Uzi. Third.

What? Oh, is that the word? Third. And Hayden. Let's go. Let's fucking go This has been Key Henderson, folks. As always, please like, comment, subscribe, follow us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify Podcasts. Leave us a five-star review. We are here each and every week. Every week. Love that. Thank you for coming on, Key. For sure. 200 and something. 200 is something. Y'all stay tuned to 300 is something. Peace, y'all.