Amber Grimes Interview: Music Rollout Masterclass (6lack, Summer Walker)

Even if a label or an artist does start a trend, it still has to work. I've been a part of campaigns where you spent $10,000 to 50,000 on a trend with the biggest, oh my god, like Addison Rae, like level TikToker who you know, like gets results. The creative just is not there, and nothing happens. It's always gonna be up to the world of TikTok or up to the world of creators to identify with it, relate to it, and want to participate in it, and they're who take you from having you know the 10 creates that you paid for to the hundred thousand creates that come organically because the shit is good. A few moments later. Have you guys had anybody walk out on the podcast yet? Not yet, but we're waiting. No, no. We'd love that. One more time. One more time. One more time. Spend a rock. Spend a boomer tap. Hit me, baby. One more time. I'm extremely, extremely honored to be welcoming in on the One More Time podcast Canadian singer, songwriter. It's Grimes.

Jesus Christ, Henry. Let's go. For so many reasons, that's not Grimes. It's not. First off, she doesn't have a kid with Elon Musk. Isn't Elon's baby mama? Second of all, she's not white. Oh, it's Grimes White. Third of all, she's one of the best dressed, one of the most powerful women in the music business. We got the EVP GM of LVRN, Love Renaissance. We got Amber Grimes in the motherfucking building. Let's go. Thanks for coming, Amber. Of course. I I love that by the way. Thank you. Grimes is like my arch nemesis because I want her Instagram name. Oh, because she has that Grimes. Have you like made an offer? Absolutely not. I'm not DMing her. It's awesome. She scares me Damn. No, I was, you know, I was telling Henry, like, I left my house and I, you know, I was a little nervous coming to this one. Why? You you're just one of the guests that I've been like super excited to try and get on the show because I just think that you have so much value to bring to our audience. You've done so much cool shit in the business.

And like honestly, we also haven't had enough freaking women on the show. It's like people are starting to think that we got some weird thing again. I don't know. Like, we need That's what I thought. We need that. See? See? shit. I knew it. All right. Well, she she just decided to do this to tell us off and say we needed more women on the show. So you were very persistent, and I respect the hell out of that. So I was just like, you know, I was like texting you back, like maybe every fourth text, yeah, giving you the spin game. And my schedule's really fucked up. I can cuss on here, right? Fuck no. Fuck. Yeah. Like my schedule is usually very fucked up. And so I got to a point where I was like, yo, this guy's gonna fucking hate me. That's why our plan was to ambush you when you're getting off the stage at Revolt World yesterday. It was good, but we already did it. Like I had already committed myself to him. Yeah, You always know when I'm in town. So I'm about to stop posting on Instagram, but Okay, now I'm coming across as like a stalker It's persistent, like stalker.

You weren't well, in the music business, being persistent on a near stalker level is very important. I agree. It's very important for artists, producers, whatever. I've seen some of the greatest people in their like before their prime have to stalk the hell out of people for them to believe how really great they are. So I respect this. That's why I was like, yo, he's not gonna stop. So I was like, Sunday, I'll come on Sunday. Jesus Christ. And then she double texted me even. Yeah, oh wow. I was like, oh shit, Sunday, it's it's going down. Yeah, the most the most famous rapper doesn't even get this guy Starstruck like you did. I promise. I'm serious. My wife was like, Are you okay? I was like, I'm just, you know, I'm excited about this one. She has, you know, there's I mean, I'm excited for everyone, all of our guests. I love you. Not to down. I was just a little extra excited. Right. But has there been a time where you were a little like flirting with the stalker line, being persistent? Have I flirted with the stalker line? I mean, no, professionally speaking, of course. Oh, who have I had the opportunity to um oh I got a little stalky with Troy Carter when I wanted that Spotify job. Oh, yeah.

That's probably that that's my that's my near my nearest stalker story is like literally, I was like, I was willing to do like anything to get that job. I really wanted it. And so I'm like, okay, cool, let me find out who the person is. And when I found out it was Troy Carter, I like was very blessed to have like a very close degree of separation. Um, and I had to kind of like stalk a couple of people to get there. So it was multiple stalks. Well, because I had to, I had to get to Tuma, who I had like a cool relationship with because I'd met Tuma a long time ago when he worked at MTV. Because Tuma used to program MTV Jams, such a legend. Um, and I kind of kept our relationship going in a genuine way because I used to give him Reeboks. So like if he would come to town, I'd be like, hey, Tuma, like this is Amber that works with Boo. I just want to pull up on you, see if I can give you these new Iversons or whatever. And like everybody loves free stuff. So I never my stalking was easy because I'm like, but I have something for you. Um and so me and Tuma were cool enough for me to be able to text him and stuff.

So I was like, yo, Tuma, I heard you just started a job at Spotify. Like, I'm trying to reach Troy Carter. So he like gave me his information, but I also called like three other people. I called JR McKee, my one of my good friends, and was like, you know, Troy Carter, right? And he's like, Yeah, kind of. I'm like, can you email him for me and just like tell him like I'm cool? Like I'm like, I don't care what you say. I asked my friend Key. I was just like, just like hit him and be like, she's good, and then I'll do the rest. And so that's that's who I stalked. And it all worked out. Yeah, that's a pretty light stalk. I mean, but there was multiple people, bro. Don't forget it. Like, you know, it was It was planned. I was just stalking her. I had a stalk strategic. It was a one-to-one stalk at this point. You know what I mean? No strategy at all. No, no. Just straight like spray and pray. Come on. I asked for a couple cosigns. I asked for red and TP. Yep. And I don't know if they ever actually hit you. But like, okay. Cause that'd be weird if they didn't. We got a good group chat. It's very random, but they always like calling me a stalker. No, you guys all they always put the podcast in the group chat when they're on it and stuff.

So they, you know, Red, We made the group chat, bro. Let's go. Yeah, twice. Actually. Twice. Back to back. But your stalk is strategic because you you know when I'm in town. So I'm here. So you are what I'd like to think like the missing puzzle piece to now, I think, like the perfect puzzle at LVRN. Like they were already absolutely crushing it. But I I feel like with you on board now, it just seems like that train is just continuing to move at like light speed down the tracks, right? So, like, what excited you most about joining LVRN? Because I have some suspicions, but um, well, it's so crazy because like I I feel like I've worked there for like 10 years, like and and why is that for people that don't know? You know, uh, Sean, Tune, like I've those guys, I've known them since I was 16 years old. Um, everybody else I probably met in college, like between the ages like uh 18 and 21. So at this point, like I'm I'm not as young as I look. I um I've known them all for over a decade, and um just the amount of pulling each other up that we've done over the years, like it gets crazy.

Like, I'm when I got my job at Def Jam, like Tune and Sean used to come to my office. They worked at DTP, and I'm like, yeah, come to my office. I got fly shit going on. You know, I come inspire you guys. Come to my office. I'm literally like booze assistant. And but that was that was great. I'm like, Tune, drop out of school. You don't need school. We're gonna make it. So, like, cool. Did he drop out? Yeah, he did. Me and Tune have a bad thing where we like do take each other's terrible advice about everything. Like the dares that go back and forth. So, yeah. But it worked out so well. Exactly. That's the point. like it could have failed miserably. Matt, him and Sean used to have a management company called Crowd Control. I was on a reality show with Nick Cannon and they were my managers. I wanted justice to be my stylist. Like, there's so much. Yo, this is so much full circle. No, it was crazy. It was crazy. There's so much on and off. And then when I got to Spotify, I'm like, yeah, like who am I gonna help? My friends. And so just the push and pull and all of the back and forth of us helping each other out in our career. Like, I guess it's like the perfect love story for us all end up working together in the same place. But the ultimate reason for me wanting to be a part of LVRN and for them being willing to have me at this point in their career is that we all think the same.

You know, storytelling has always been a big part of my career. Um, storytelling is what that company is about. They care about marketing, they care about branding their artists, and they care about rollouts. And that is something that I think that I am in music, I was I started doing music at the most like incredible time for marketing and rollouts. There were there was so much opportunity and so much you could do. And so I did a lot of that, I guess, independently at these companies that I worked with, but then getting to be with people that were like-minded like me and thought about promoting an artist and a song or a project the way that I did was just like this is this is how I would like to end my legacy in the music business. Absolutely. These are the ones. These guys, because obviously, for those who aren't familiar, LVRN, five male co-founders of the company, they are what I like to call the kings of rollouts. But I'm gonna go ahead and stamp this shit right now on the one more time podcast. Drop a drop something for me, Henry.

Jesus, the queen of rollouts is here on the show. Stamped. Sealed. Delivered. I mean, y'all are definitely ruling this, you know. Uh rolling rollout kingdom. I don't know, what can we call it? I don't know. A rollout kingdom is cute. A rollout kingdom is kind of cute. That's really cute. Okay, thank you, thank you. All right. Sure. Uh what what percentage of the industry though, do you think it like is it a big problem that a majority are not focused on that? No, I listen. Now, like rollout's not like a new thing, right? Like, I I actually hate the word now. It's kind of it's like it's because usually it's not associated with the right things. And like saying rollout started to have a connotation of it's like, oh, when you're really doing something disruptive, it was like, okay, this is a whole rollout, this is strategically planned. I get it, like it's full circle. But now I feel like rollout is just like uploading it to DistroKid. And that and that's your rollout. Like your rollout has become such a common word that it's like whatever you decide to do, yeah, was your rollout. Um, and it's not quite as uh disruptive and exciting as it used to be before.

So I'm glad to have been a part of the exciting part. There's also just a shit ton more music in general, you know? There's just so much music now. It's like can everyone be disruptive? So, but it this is the thing, right? Somebody needs to be because that's kind of the only time we pay attention. But now disruptive looks like TikTok, and it's not even up to the artist to be disruptive. There are creators being disruptive with your music, and it's about how you lean in to their disruption. Now it's just a response to what's happening. It's not even it it is sometimes. I won't take anything away from the artist, but right now it TikTok has changed things. And I I will always say for the better. Um now you have a group of people who add context to your music. It might not even been what your song is about. I remember when Mariah the Scientist, um, her song started going viral, and people were using spread thin to like tell stories about like, oh, my listen to this crazy story. My baby daddy left me on the side of the road, and then and people were just going like into these deep, I went down a deep dark hole, like, oh my God, people's lives are insane.

Um, and it was all the soundtrack to these stories was spread thin. And so and she didn't plan that. And she didn't, not to my knowledge. And so it made me care about the record because it gave context. So now when I hear this song, I think about this this joyful moment I have when I'm scrolling TikTok and finding out all these fun stories or crazy stories or whatever. It's it's context. And so that's all a rollout is too, is giving your album context, giving your song context. And now there's a if you make a good enough song or crazy enough song, if your booty hole's brown, like people will people will give your song context, and then all as an artist, all you have to do is fucking lean in. Yeah, lean into what's already like given to you. That's it. You know, someone at Revolt World yesterday said that my booty hole brown like is gonna go down as one of the most epic lyrics of all time. Like who said someone said something like that where I was just like, that's insane to say. But yeah, but like what's the difference? But she disrupted. What's the difference between that and my neck, my back? Oh yeah, and my crack.

I was like, are you gonna do that? What's the difference between that and the the three six mafia live on tour? They're they're talking crazy right now with that too, like Sexy Red's not the first person to to speak, you know, to say raunchy things, right? No, for sure. But it's she did it in a in a cool, fun way, and we never heard it quite said like that, and we love it. It's disruptive. So, so how much of the context that's getting added to these songs, specifically maybe focusing on TikTok, for example, right? How much of that that we see as you know, consumers is artist and label led versus creator led? Because you're mentioning that to your knowledge, Mariah did not like pay some influencers to start this trend necessarily, right? And it caught on and clearly like it gave context to the song without her even leading that effort. So, you know, what what would you say the the breakdown is? What I will say is that like even if a label or an artist does start a trend, it still has to work. Drop some shit, bro.

It doesn't. Wait, are you, are you asleep over there? Well, she's not wearing headphones so she can't hear the sound. effect. I can hear it. I feel the sound, yeah, I'm like she can probably imagine a better sound effect than even what you got going on. Yeah, it doesn't, it doesn't matter. Like, I I've been a part of campaigns where you spent $10,000 to 50,000 on a trend with the biggest, oh my god, like Addison Rae, like level TikToker who you know, like gets results, and you could spend with them on the wrong create, the wrong, like the creative just is not there, and nothing happens. So if a label starts a trend or pays for a trend, then I'm somebody over there had some great creative, but also it has to start trending. Yeah, so it's up to other, it's always gonna be up to the world of TikTok or up to the world of creators to identify with it, relate to it, and want to participate in it, and they're who take you from having you know the 10 create creates that you paid for to the 100,000 creates that come organically because the shit is good. There has to be some level of organic.

Yeah. And you can try and you know put a little kindling down, but you cannot pay for a million creates. Yeah, yeah. Or somebody's bag is different and it's a fucking waste of money. Yeah. No, I mean, because I think this is exactly the example of, you know, every artist out there, independent artists. I swear I hear this way too much where it's like, man, if I was just signed to a major, I'd be out of here. Like, if a major could just break an artist every fucking time, they would never lose. Like they would have a hundred percent success rate. Yeah, so you're right, like it has to resonate, like it has to stick. Yeah. So it's the same thing with fucking trends and content. Like, you can't just like think that because you drop a bag on X amount of creators or even the top creators on a platform, that that's just going to lead to more people catching on. Like, this is not how it works, right? I don't ever want to take away from anything that anybody created. I'm sure there's a uh a case study or a you know, a story that I haven't heard about like, no, I really popped this shit off and like more power to you. But I feel like this era of music right now, marketing is about response.

Something happens and it's about how you respond to it. And I give people a lot of credit for how they respond, whether that's label, artist, whatever, because a lot of people don't even do that. I I've seen I I saw when we were in that era when a song would go viral and people would be like, Great, so this is happening. Like, I hope it goes all the way. Let's see what happens. And now that shit doesn't work either. So just your song going viral now isn't enough. Your response is what takes it to the next level. How do you respond? Oh my God. That's so sad. Like her saying that. I just like is it sad? I don't know. I think it's incredible because people have to work again. I know, but it's a good way to play it It's more jobs. Okay, let me just say this: that like most artists out there still, I think have like a misconstrued notion of like if I just go viral, that it's going to work. That's why you guys have this podcast, right? I'm telling you, just going viral is not enough. The problem with just going viral is people fall in love with your song and not you as an artist. So if you actually want to have a career, if you want to have any longevity, that viral moment is an opportunity for you to sell your entire self. Like it is, it is now you you needed to have had your brand together.

You needed to have everything together. So you got people in. People are like knocking on your front door, they open it, they gotta like what they see. They come to your storefront and they say, okay, cool, like the mannequins look good in the window. I come in here and the shit is trash. I'm leaving. So going viral is just another, this is the new form of a one-hit wonder. You know, this is Mambo number five. This is the Macarena. Don't you talk shit about Mambo number five? Mambo number five. is a jam. Lou Bega, Lou Bega. And still, and still, I'm sure makes tons of money. Dude, can't name another song. No way. Listen, what happened to Mambo's one through four? I'm just saying. Iconic. There's nothing wrong. There's also nothing wrong with having a Mambo. I I would love a Mambo number five with one of my artists right now. Amen. But if the artist wants to be Beyoncé, yeah, then their response to getting a Mambo number five needs to be on the level of a Beyonce. Just going viral isn't enough. That the the gone are the days of okay, my song is popular and everybody knows me, and I hope this shit works out. It's not. So what is some advice that you how would you guide an artist to respond?

Like, what does that actually mean in practice? How how do you handle a viral moment? So there's it's a couple of steps. So y'all listen the fuck up right now. You know, because I don't like that my problem with viral is like, okay, like how, when, why? Like, I feel like if you can't explain what you're doing or how you did it, you don't know what you're doing. And so I take a lot of pride in like studying this and the moves that people make. And so for me, one, the first thing that people miss a lot of the time when they go viral is straight optimizing your platforms. So like I've seen songs go viral. I will, because I'm a freak of nature, go check out the artists. They won't have the song in their bio, they won't have it pinned on their Spotify, they won't write in their community on YouTube. So sad. The song is not their latest in their TikTok thing. They haven't used the sound themselves. You haven't used your own sound on your go ahead with your bomb. You haven't used your own sound on your own page.

So now when I find out who you are, I go and I don't even associate the sound with you and your artistry because you're like, well, everyone else is making the content. No, no, fool. You you have to make the content too. Talk to them. Talk to them. So optimization's so so important. And it gets more strategic than that. Everybody, every independent artist has Spotify for artists. Go in there, find out what your top 10 cities are. Make a make a TikTok that's like, shout out to Berlin for like loving my song. That's a good one. You know what I'm saying? You have them. The proof is there, right? Like every time you have a milestone, celebrate your milestone. So if your song gets 10,000 streams, make a green screen video and go, oh my gosh, this is so cool. I don't care. Like, lean in. That's that's optimizing. Just making sure that your song now is discoverable. Everywhere that there's an opportunity to discover, that song needs to be there. If it doesn't get you one stream, then I'm I'm crazy.

Yeah. Um, optimizing your pages, um, making the content, which again goes hand in hand. Make your own content. I I happen to work with one of the best artists and content creators in the world, baby Tate. I knew that was coming. She's the queen of that shit. She's the queen of content. Oh my god. One of the only artists that I've ever seen create a trend. It's not easy to do. So when her song, Hey Mickey was going viral, um, it started going viral because there was um some K pop fans were doing like fan cams, and they were doing like just posting videos of cute boys and stuff, and like that was really cool. We tried to lean in by like doing some YouTube shorts of like fan cams of like American actors or whatever it is we were trying to do. We did a fan cam of Tate, and then Tate's like, okay, cool, this isn't really working. And so what does she do? She does a really awesome makeup transition because that's what she does. That's what she does. The fan cams didn't mean much to her. That wasn't her world, but she loves makeup and she has to get dressed every day. So she does the most awesome hey Mickey makeup transition, and now the create the creative has changed, and then the create start going because it was a really cool makeup transition.

That's it. Started by the artist. And the best thing is that like just because what what started your song like getting hot, you can always like add fuel to the fire or like I don't know, like shift the direction of the of the fire. And that's what she did. She's like, yo, I I this isn't working. I don't know what else to do here. Let me do what I do. And now, like the makeup thing went crazy. And then another creator came and like added a mirror to it and changed the game. And we're on a photo shoot and we're at a photo set, and Tate's like, oh, who has a mirror? Because I gotta do this person's trend now. Like continuing to lean in and not giving a shit as an artist, you cannot be embarrassed to promote your own shit. How many artists are not on TikTok, first of all? Well, that is we're not even gonna have that discussion. They don't deserve that attention, Henry. They don't. Yeah. Okay. They're not listening to our show because they don't care about learning. But if you are listening and you don't, like just realize that we're moving on from you very quickly for a reason. Don't give them attention, Henry. If you make anything, and there's a platform for you to sell that thing or for people to discover that thing, and you're not on it, you're not fucking serious.

Yeah. So there's that. Yeah. It's been addressed. So when you do have a TikTok, because I'm gonna go on a limb and say every artist out there in the world has a TikTok because they understand what's going on in this 2023. Um, leaning in, making content, making a hundred videos with your song. Like, this is what I love about Flyana Boss. That running shit's working. So much so many running videos. They didn't stop running yet. It's giving Forrest gump. They did remix videos. And Missy was running her ass around too. It's giving Forrest gump. run. And I love that because that's what was working. And so they they figured it out. They said, okay, cool, there's a little spark here. How can we do this better? How can we take in requests? Let's go run at Disneyland, let's go run on sunset. And they just kept doing it that consistency. There's five people who are gonna say it's annoying, and a hundred people who are just seeing it for the first time. I care about these a hundred people. I watched like 10 of them before I thought they were annoying. So that's pretty good rate still.

Like that's and you know the song. You know, the snow craze? Come on, I mean, yeah. Hello, hello. But this, like, what's the difference in that than a song being played on the radio in the nineties over and over and over again, and you're like, I'm sick of it, but I'm sprung, you're like it's stuck in my head now. What's the difference? Or just a general ad. What's the difference? Like a jingle that you fucking know because it's been played for you a million times. What's the difference? There's no difference. What's the difference of Lil Baby having to get retired from being number one on 106 and Park because the video was coming on again, again, again, again. You know the song. It doesn't matter who you annoy. That is like literally the point. This is a universal stalking. Like your job is to stalk everybody in the world to hear your song. Yeah. You know, bring it right back around and stalk it. I mean, there's nothing wrong with it. Should the episode be like, just get out there and stalk though? Like, I don't know. It should be something about stalking Like queen stalking. Stalking. strategically, strategically.

Um speaking of um, hey, Mickey, I'd love to kind of discuss like uh the just the fact that it was an older record, right? Was there like a decision to try and bring this back? Or how did that whole no? I was in Costa Rica. You're always in Costa Rica. Speaking of stalking, you love Costa Rica too much strategically. She puts it. out there, man. I'm just an Amber Grimes fan. Come on. I was in Costa Rica. This was like um uh right before New Year's. And again, I'm gonna say Spotify for artists, Apple for artists, any platform that will give you data, pay attention to your data, pay attention to the back of your store. Um, Quinn, my partner, who's managed Tate for a long time, has done an incredible job with her. He stalks her Spotify for artists. And so Quinn is in there just looking on his daily look like he always does, and he keeps sending me a screenshot. I'm on vacation. I'm like, Quinn, please. The Costa Rican sunset is crazy. he's like yo. Hey, Mickey, this song that Tate did six years ago at the time, it's starting to see some smoke.

It's doing like 10,000 streams a day. It was doing like 30 before. I'm like, okay, cool, tight, I'm getting it. Next day, he's like, yo, this thing jumped to 15,000 a day. Cool. It text me again, and I'm like, oh, it's doing 30,000 a day. I'm like, okay, at this point, I need to pack my bags and come home because we we have work to do. we once we identified that it was moving and it was on this upward trajectory. Um, we just kind of like as a team, everybody threw their hands up and was like, this is what we're gonna focus on. Let's see what can happen. If it's gonna grow and grow every day, how can we dissect it? How can we lean in? How can we add? Um, paying attention to the data, where do we need to do Spotify audio ads? The number one, the number one thing I think that changed the trajectory of the song outside of Tate starting that new TikTok creative, um, was shooting a new visual. A visual at all. The song never had a video. And so putting something new in the marketplace, and I'm gonna say this is the biggest part, the artist being in the new visual, not an animated visualizer, not some weird, you know, thing on loop that whatever, if that's your vibe. The artist being present and active and treating that song like a new song.

We um worked with Nicole Kirkland, did like the whole like remake of the old hey Mickey video, how it looked. We had the cheerleader outfits, we did it all on a white wall. It cost us nothing. It cost us like a little, not nothing. I'm sorry, that's disrespectful. It costs us a little bit. Relatively speaking. She forgot our audience was independent artists. But nowhere, nowhere close. They spent their whole life savings. And I'll never lie to anybody. So, like, nowhere close to what we spend on a regular video, and it went crazy. Like it hit a million so fast, and that new visual gave us just like it gave us so many legs. So now we have new YouTube shorts, and YouTube is like, oh, we want to give you guys a billboard for using the products. One of the dancers, the dancer that played Mickey, he's on tour with Beyoncé right now. Wow. So, like just the connectivity of him being there, and now when you go to Beyonce's tour, people are like, Oh, I know him from somewhere. We still win off of that. You know what I mean?

So the and Chris Brown did the same thing with Under the Influence, shooting that whole new video, even after Nicole Kirkland had a viral dance video. He did two new visuals. Um there's something to be said about just saying, okay, accepting that something's happening with your catalog and treating it like a new song. How would you promote a brand new record that came out? No stone unturned. What is left to do? What is left to do on the table for this song? And that's what we did. And I feel like you talked about, you know, posting some of those milestones that you're hitting. I was so tapped into the Tate evolution of Hey Mickey, just rising the charts. It was like 50,000 streams a day, 100,000 streams a day. Hey, can we get to 250,000? Can we get to a million? That was it. Like she was that was it. She was encouraging me. I was like, I'm about to stream this like five times for her today, at least, you know? Me and Quinn take credit for the things that we should take credit for. I would never take credit for the things that the artist does. Tate is so in control of her career, and it made all the difference.

It's it's one thing to go, look, guys, we made it to 10,000. It's another thing to go, wow, you guys think we can make it to 20. Can you help me out? And then people, if you you you have fans, every everybody's talking to somebody. If you have one follower, then you have one person that will do something you asked them to do. That that little bit, I think, made a difference of us hitting our 100k. When she was like, oh my God, like we're at 90, you guys think we can do 100? Like, help me. Yeah. She literally just like was like, help me out, y'all. Yeah. And who wouldn't want to help Tate? I mean, for sure. And the song's good. So it's a comment that helps it's a great song. And so just to be clear, because I think this is important, like, you're you're not having meetings with Tate having to uh encourage her to be active on the content side, right? Okay. See. No. Do we do we throw in a little like uh okay, cool. This is what we saw on Spotify for artists today. Here's a screenshot, this is what's happening. She needs the information, right? Sure.

She still needs to be allowed to be an artist. So as managers, it's our job to make sure she has the resources, make sure she has the tools, make sure she has the information. If we have an idea, we also will go, you know what you should do today? Like for your for your TikTok, like try this. Yeah. The reason why she's a great artist is because she'll do it. Yeah. I don't want to have to ask you something. I don't want to fight with you. I have an idea. Let's try it. Yeah. Let's try it. And she knows her, she knows her brand. She knows her space. So if we do ask her to do something and it's whack, we'll ask and she'll go, okay, cool. I heard you. I'm gonna do it like this. For sure. So, you know, like I said, you're the queen of rollouts, so I do think that hey, Mickey was one of my favorites that I want to talk about. That's you know, a recent one. I want to talk about a few others that you've been a part of, right? And so one that I had on my list was the the other queen herself, Summer Walker, arguably the queen of RB right now. I'm not gonna have, I'm not gonna make you stamp that or I don't know if you want to stamp it, that's fine, but I'm not gonna put you on the spot there. I won't, I don't draw division amongst women.

Okay, yeah. That's fine. But for for me, I feel like she's running shit right now. Yeah. And so karma, I once again, I'm not an RB fan, and I still became part of this rollout, and I became part of this experience around karma. So I, you know, I'd like to just have you break down some of the components of it, some of the things that like, you know, you were involved with and like why that one resonated so well with her audience, for example. Yeah, I think when once karma started doing what it was doing, I was um at a psychotic level of research and how catalog can like really what do they call it? Re-re research. Um, at this point, I'm like, yo, so anything can happen. This is amazing. I want to know how to react and respond. And um, this was probably my favorite one because you know, Summer is an artist who's like, you know, what's happening? Okay, that sounds cool.

Y'all let me know what y'all want to do. And I'm like, yes, because I want to do everything. Um, so I love that about her. Um, this song was one that I said that this is thanks to the TikTok creators. This is thanks to every creator on TikTok that ever used this sound. There were about 11 different creates. Um, we even spoke to TikTok. The amount of songs that are going uh viral all at one time for Summer Walker is out of this world on TikTok. Like how many was it? It's it's so many. I I have um, you know, you can like bookmark things on TikTok. Yeah, like almost every song off of Last Day of Summer and a couple off over it. I have a bookmark saved of every time I find a create, I just put it there to make sure that I can see when something goes viral. Wow. Um, so specifically karma was on last day of summer. Yep. Um, it started going viral because of the sped up sound, and then the sped up sound ended up. Yeah, we can get into it. Oh, Henry, we've been getting into it lately. Yeah, this is the big difference, right? Hey, Mickey was a cool case study because it was just the regular version of the song, yeah. And so we, you know, ended up having to make new versions and doing all these other things.

A new version landed in our lap with karma, and the question was begged, so what are you gonna do with this? So someone sped it up, someone sped it up, someone random, you know, just a page that speeds up songs. Okay. Um, sped up R&B songs is the handle. Yes, and then um a creator named Who is Reese made a dance to it. Um, that dance started to catch on, and then after that, again it again it spawned so many different different creatives. The first thing we started doing was the very first thing we did is take the who is Reese dance. Summer was not about to get on TikTok and and dance, so we just took all the creators and like you know, made a a mix of of them doing the dance, and Summer told them thank you. Yeah, simple, yeah, simple, yeah, but powerful. Thank people for supporting. Yeah, it's a crazy idea, right? To thank your fans Yeah. I want to like we'll get into the real strategic stuff in a minute, but like thank you, just the bar is so low, guys. Sometimes, and so one the the way that people react to things on TikTok is very important too, because there's a there's been an issue, and there's still an issue on TikTok and on all these platforms about creators getting credit, especially black creators.

So, for an artist, arguably the queen of RB, to I said it, tag your name and say thank you and put you in a video, put 10 different people in a video. You see in the comments that people go, This is so dope of her, this is so cool. She actually recognized, she don't have to do that. Yeah, and so then okay, cool. We get more love, more people hear this song because we added context. Yes, the context right now is your favorite artist sees you, she's a real person, right? So that's like this is the low-hanging fruit. And I don't want to talk about all the stuff over people's head because sometimes some people only have the low-hanging fruit, and if you're not doing that, you have nothing. And this doesn't, and this doesn't have to oh, sorry, this doesn't have to happen at the scale of Summer Walker either. So that's what anyone, yeah. That's the most important fucking part. Even if you have one fan, thank them. If you're not thanking the one fan, yeah, it's insane. People are like people get way too caught up in the new fans and not serving the ones you already have because you can lose them very quickly. Yeah, and these creators who are doing so much for your song, just thank them. Yeah.

Cool. We did that. I'm like, yo, the sped up sound is going crazy. We should deliver it. Because the problem is, I see, I see it all over YouTube. People have already put up their own version of Karma Sped Up. It's on TikTok. And that doesn't discourage me. That doesn't go, oh man, there's already a version up, right? No, it just teaches me a lesson. And if this person, this random ass person made it on YouTube, YouTube and they got a hundred thousand views on it. What will happen if Summer Walker acknowledges a sped up version that she's approved the mix on and puts it out on her page? So then that's what we did. We made some YouTube shorts. We made a YouTube video. We sped it up. We delivered it. And it was like, huh. All right, here we go again. So now the song is climbing on Spotify, like 200,000 daily listeners. And then we add this new thing in the mix, Karma Sped Up. And I'm like, yo, can we take it a step further? And I'll go back to the reason why I love working at LVRN. Anybody from the intern to myself, if you have an idea, you can do it. That does not happen at every job.

It does not happen at every label. I've worked at corporate companies. Just because I go, I want to try something. There's not a bunch of people that go, hey, we support you. Let's see if that shit works. It's that simple, right? Anything that we want to do, we can do. And so I go, guys, like, what if we just sped up the whole last day of summer album and see what happens? I'm doing my research, and I'm like, has anybody done this before? As a major artist, I know that I don't want to get into arguments with people from Florida and all the other places No, this is serious. Oh, they were from Florida. This is serious. They were from Florida. There are there are other towns who have created sped up music. Oh, yeah, okay. Florida's known for it. I saw that in the comments on one of our videos. Yeah, okay. I don't, I know y'all like to tussle. This isn't about that. Hey, we're telling you. Because we respect the originators of it, but on a major artist level, at that time when people were just Miguel is like redelivering his sped up, Chris Brown's redelivering under the influence sped up. I'm like, what about the whole album?

And the reason why we could do it on summer is because it wasn't just karma that was going viral. It was BP, it was CPR, it was deep, everything from this project sped up. So we just sped up the whole project. Shout out to Interscope for also supporting this movement and taking like a crazy leap with us. I'm like I'm putting this through the system. Let's do it. And it worked. It's there. And what I learned about sped up music is all sped up music does is make people want to listen to the original version more. Thank you. Interesting. That was the case study. So safe to say that you're a fan of releasing different versions of your song, whether it's sped up or slowed down in reverb or a cappella or instrumentals. Like are you a fan of that? I'm a fan of releasing a lot of product, more product, different product. I'm a super fan of giving your fans what they're asking for. Yeah, fair. Fair. There's if somebody else is doing it already, and you have a case study over here that people like it or they want to hear it, or they're dancing to it or whatever. it's common sense. Common sense is telling me that there's an audience for this.

It's an alley-oop. It's just again for the five people on Twitter that go, Why would Summer do this? There were a hundred people that were like, Thank God I can finally listen to this on Spotify. I can't keep my YouTube open and text at the same time. And and and there was, I I only care about, I only care about positive energy. I only care about the supporters. Like this is a distraction. There's always more people that support you. And so for the people that wanted to hear it sped up, they got it. And the people that wanted to hear it regular, it didn't go anywhere. It's still there. Listen to what you like. We have we have platforms now. DSPs, it's your choice. Take your poison, babe. I love it. I love it. You know, so that that was a big part of that. But with karma, um, unlike you know what the strategy that we took with hey Mickey, like we took it all the way. We we optimized the hell out of all of Summer's pages, so everything pinned on the YouTube, even at this moment. Five, five, four years, excuse me, four or five years now down the road, Karma is the first video when you open her YouTube. It is pinned on her Spotify.

We're delivering new videos to Apple. We're doing a cappella. We we just re-released the last day of summer vinyl, and we put the Karma Acapella on that vinyl to make it exclusive. The campaign continues. Um, but releasing the whole project was incredible, and then we sent it to radio, and that was the big gamble. And like, shout out to to Big Tune Day and the whole radio team, the urban radio team at Interscope for taking that chance again and saying, okay, cool, can we take a five-year-old song to radio? And summer got our first number one. That's just wild that you know, to your point, just realizing the power of catalog that it can even work on arguably uh, you know, a platform that's supposed to be delivering like the newest latest and greatest hits, like that that's amazing. Well, this is the thing. You said it earlier, there's a lot of music now, right? And there's a lot of new people on the earth. A song that came out five years ago is new to somebody else. Yes. And so if you just always treat your catalog like there's like it's new, like there's something to discover, there's somebody to discover it. catalog's serious business.

And the more you have, the more that a fan can really deep dive. If you catch, you know, find your new favorite show on Netflix and there's one season, you'd be pretty sad. If there's eight seasons, you're like, let's fucking go, let's do this. I'm not gonna lie. I accidentally listened to all versions of this song recently. So like I clicked on one version and Spotify just fed me the sped up and the slow down and reverb, and I kept, and I just I went through I got through all the listens. Like I swear. So it works. It I you got three times the streams or four times the streams than you would have if it was just the one version and one product. But so you know, I do want to pivot into I think something really unique about your story, and I'm sure there's others, but like for me, I haven't talked to many people who have had not only the experience on the label side, but also at the experience at the DSP. So at Spotify, right? So you were, I guess, the first person to head up independent artist marketing within the hip-hop and and RB space at Spotify. Yep.

So, like what what did they bring you on specifically to do and and why, right? Like what what were they looking, what were they hoping for, right? Um, I think what they were hoping for and what I set out to do was very different. Okay, let's hear, let's hear both. But I I understood the assignment and like that the thing is to get your foot in the door, right? So there was um a new team, they had an independent team run by Gemma Sett, my old manager, I love her, um, super passionate about independent artists. And um, they broke up and restructured the team into genres. So there was a senior manager for rock, senior manager for like just every genre. And um they were looking for a senior manager of Urban indie is what they called it. Okay. Um, I heard through the grapevine from Key um that they were looking for somebody for this job, and when I found out one, I was in love with their platform, and then I was okay, cool, that job is mine. Like I have to, I have to have that. It has my name on it. Um, and so when I went after it, they were literally just looking for somebody to look after independent artists in the urban space.

I think um this is 2017, and I don't think that the world like understands how it's about to get rocked by independent artists. Like so, who was independent that you were working with at this time? When I started working at Spotify, my independent artists were 6ix9ine, Trippie Redd, uh Lil Baby, City Girls, Lil Peep, um just these little independent artists, just these tiny independent artists. XXX, Yes. Come on. this is what's happening at the time when I get this job. Everyone's independent at some point in their career. Like when you're starting out, you don't just start making music signed to a major. I mean, maybe there's a few examples, but I'm not gonna go there. But yeah, it's like these people were independent. Yeah, and my thing was like, okay, cool. Like one, people don't know anything about Spotify at this time. So that's the one, that's the one hurdle. But then the other thing is like everybody wants a record deal. That's like the norm of rap and RB and any genre.

It's like, okay, cool, I want a record deal. This uh, can I really be a successful independent artist? Isn't really a conversation because Spotify is just starting. So the the this conversation, like everybody understanding streaming is what's really pushing the narrative of independent artists forward because Daniel Ek's whole dream for his company is that more people can make a living off of their music. That dream is only realized because of the platform that was created. Do you think that's true? Absolutely. Okay, yeah, absolutely. Okay. There's some kid that we have listen, I see a lot of AR research. There's a bunch of kids that we're looking at on a sheet every day that make maybe five, ten thousand dollars a month and nobody knows them. Yeah. Wow. And at that time, if I'm whatever age they are, whatever age they are, I wasn't making $10,000 a month when I was in my 20s. No, that's true. Hell, I was running around giving people Reeboks for fucking Skittles. Shaqs and Iversons, bro. So that that's that's insane to be able to make $100,000 a year from music that you make in your basement. Yeah.

And that dream is only realized because now it's now CD babies and STEMs and all of these distros are starting to come up where they give you the opportunity to release your music independently and get it out there. And then you have Spotify, and then you have your own means. You have the internet, and you can kind of, there's like this ecosystem that's forming in music that allows an artist to be independent. Yeah. That's why there's this big, it's like a big bang theory for like independent artists at this time. And I come and I join this unknown company where everyone's like, what's you know, what does it really mean? Some of us are scared of it. Taylor Swift's not giving her music, whatever. Yeah, remember that's right. You don't remember shit was wild. Yeah, no one, no one really understood what Spotify was. Jay-Z wasn't, wasn't on Spotify. Watch the Throne wasn't on Spotify. Heartbreaking anyway. Travesty. Yeah, yeah. So um, yeah, those are my artists, and so I'm coming in, and most of my artists are like virtually unknown at the time. And for me, I go back to that reebok mentality.

I go, this is dope because it's like so it would be so much easier for me to get. I'm like, who's who was the big artist at that time? Like, name anyone, it'd be it'd be so much easier for me to get this huge major, yeah, major label artists and say, like, I did this for them, I did that for them. I have these kids that nobody knows, like, they don't have a lot of resources or whatever. And I'm like, okay, cool, what can I do for them? What resources do I have at this company to help them like achieve their dream? How can I put somebody's son on a billboard? Was always my question. Because then again, 2017, Spotify like reinvented the the billboard for artists. Now I'm like, you know, now it's a little like I feel like the artists don't even care anymore. They don't even post them when they get their billboards. But at this time, it was like a big deal to get in New Music Friday and to get the billboard spot and to get a little like home page takeover on Spotify. And these are all the tools that I have at my advantage.

And so who I gave them to and how I gave them to them and what I did next to them and what Tuma would do for me. And Rap Caviar Concerts started, and all of these new tools started happening, and I could take these artists that again nobody knows and didn't have a lot of their own resources and give them things that they didn't have or give them opportunities that I could have or should have given to J. Cole and Kendrick Lamar. But I was like, no, let's do Cyhi the Prince and let's do this for Trippie Redd, and let's, you know. You didn't mention Cyhi. Yeah, well. he's a podcast favorite for sure. Oh he's amazing. And he said he would do the podcast like several times, and we haven't yet got him. But you also said you do it, and it took us a while to get you. Exactly. So I'm gonna just continue that stalker vibe. We're going to DM him again after this. A hundred percent. Amber Grimes said. I'll do the same that Cyhi and Redd did. Say hi. I love you. It's Amber. We go way back. Please come and sit on this podcast. I'm having a great time. We're in Stone Mountain. We're also in Stone Mountain, where he's from.

And I want to hear the freestyle. Yeah. Anyways. Um, yeah, so my my initiative there was like how how much can I help an independent artist? How can I help uh an independent artist that makes hip hop and RB be looked at as major because of what I do and what I help them with and what I contribute to their career? And so I don't think that Spotify necessarily was like, spend all the budgets on, like, I don't know if that was their goal for me, but they were supportive in it. And I would fight like tooth and nails to get something for a Trippie Redd or a little baby, because I'm like, yo, like, and I didn't have a hard crew to convince, you know, like Tuma, Majima, Brittany, all the people that were there at the time, we had a lot of trust in that company. And so just my goal was to like help help the artist that I really believed in. Yeah, so you know, the theme of this episode clearly is like your ability to really help with the the rollout. I know we all hate that word, right? It's getting a little bit uh overused.

But how were you able to apply that mentality on the Spotify side of the house, right? Because obviously you weren't, you know, rolling out artist projects from the label side at that point, but like what what levers did you pull, or like how did you activate that mentality within the role of Spotify? So again, uh, rollouts were a little bit more fun then, and the biggest component of a rollout to me is building a world. People forget that. Like just doing some random shit is like cool. But the reason why people are dressing up to go to a Beyonce concert is because she built a world around a project that tells you how to wear, what kind of hat is appropriate, what is the color, like it tells you how to act there. There's like a challenge that happens there. There's a world when you step into this album now. And my job at Spotify, um, especially when I went from just working with the independent acts to working with the major acts, is what can I contribute to this world? How can I add context to your world?

So we'll take somebody like Black, LVRN artist. When he did East Atlanta Love Letter, um, LVRN brought it into us beautifully. You know, 20-page deck. Like this is this is why it's called East Atlanta Love Letter. That's where he's from. He wants to pay homage back to his city. He has Atlanta on his back. He takes it with him wherever he goes, no matter where he is, right? And he also was exploring themes of love, like asking questions. There were billboards with questions, if you don't remember, like, you know, do you believe in monogamy and all this really fun stuff? And I'm like, damn, like what can we contribute to this like slightly sexual conversation as a corporate company and like support Atlanta? And so, you know, today the guys come and they're like, yo, we want to bring Magic City to LA. And I'm like, yeah. Sign me the fuck up. That's actually the kitchen coming. That's actually exactly what we should do.

Now, my job is to figure out how I'm going to get this company, this corporate company to support that. They're like, What's Magic City? You're like Exactly. One second. So there's this guy named Magic. And so We're gonna get you in touch. and so I made a 10-page deck. Oh, I'd love to see that. And make sure that everybody understand the context and why this needs to happen, but also why it matters for the project. So, one Magic City is literally the most iconic place in Atlanta. Yeah, arguably, I mean, yeah. Arguably, but we're not gonna argue. This is the it's like it's Martin Luther King's house in Magic City. So this is the most iconic place, but also it is a staple and the most iconic place for Atlanta artists and for music in general. This is a place where records are broken in this city.

We are a music company. You can't say that you're in the culture or that you support the culture, or you can't benefit off the culture if you don't know the culture and you don't really embrace it. So I'm telling you, this is this is a place where young jeezy went and threw loads of cash to break some of the most iconic songs that we have in our discography right now on our platform. Yes. We need to show it love. And this is a place where men in Atlanta find love in some form or fashion. There's love in the strip club. So while we're exploring themes of love and what that looks like for people, the strip club, and this is for men and women, by the way, in Atlanta. This is a form of this is an expression of love for some people. And I put all you know, I put all this bullshit in deck, because I really believe that shit. And I want somebody else to believe it too. Is it pictures and explanations and everything? I'd love to see the deck. if you got a copy. But but it was real, and it's like how how how better could we black had already done everything for this campaign.

He had the drive-in movie theater, like everything was done. But this was like the icing on the cake. And so it was a it was a lot of it was a lot of conversation and a lot of back and forth. And I will say again, I'm so grateful for the leaders at Spotify that really either heard me out or really gave a damn about saying if you say that this is culturally relevant, because this is my job, right? I'm the I'm the senior manager of Urban. You're literally, you've hired me for my perspective. This is my perspective. This is something that we need to do. So having people that said, you know what, we trust you was important. But at the time, Tuma had built this beautiful thing called Rap Caviar that was probably it's still arguably the edgiest piece of Spotify. This is where we could kind of like take it there. And so instead of it being, you know, Spotify presents, this was one of the very first events outside of the Pantheon that was presented by Rap Caviar. And that was to me even like cooler because this playlist had already had a life and had legs. Um this playlist like that has I I made Rap Caviar socials.

So like for all of the platforms that Apple and all these other companies have, no playlist ever had a social its own social media page until Rap Caviar. It has a podcast. Fire podcast. Like that. I'm I'm proud of my contributions to that company too. Yes. Um, but the rap caviar and Carl was there at the time, and he, you know, gave the thumbs up and said, Let's do this thing, and we fucking we we had a stripper party. Wow. And it was iconic and it was controversial and it was daring and it was risky, and we got a lot of feedback about it. And nothing says to an artist that a company, a music company, really gives a shit about you, than to take a risk like that for a vision. If you love what you do, you won't work a day in your life. Those those folks, those folks back at corporate in Stockholm were like flipping. Are you sure about this? Yeah. We did We did what? I don't know what the conversation is today, but like it happened, and and I know that other companies were very inspired by that or side-eyed that and was like, Man, I wish I wish we could do something like that. But Spotify in the most positive way was like the wild wild west, streaming was like the wild wild west then.

And so we could take those type of chances and do those type of things. And my my whole goal there was to take advantage of everything I could do while it was all unknown, what was the right thing to do or what was too risky to do or whatever. Um, but we added to that world, and then Spotify played. I think in general, what all these DSPs want to do is add something special to your campaign. So when you look at like a Billie Eilish campaign, everybody from every company added something special. When you look at Olivia Rodrigo, it's like, oh, we got the track list reveal and we got this. Well, for black, we brought Magic City to LA, and that was just a crazy thing. That's insane. An insane iconic should go down in history. Hopefully, when people Google it, the podcast comes up. Shout out to you guys for giving us the opportunity. We did that actually September 18th. So the anniversary of East Atlanta Love Letter and this party just passed last week. Um, but I'm so I'm most proud of that piece in that rollout because it taught me a lot of things in my in my corporate career about like really fighting for what you believe in. And again, whether people like it or not, standing behind what they hired you for.

So if you hired me to show you what the culture is in the city that I'm from, because you want to have a presence in the city that I'm from, and you made a good hire. I'm from there. You have to trust me, and we can fight about it because I will I'll fight to the death, and yeah, and I choose my battles wisely. That was important to me. And I argued with everybody and I got people on my team to argue with me until it happened. And like I will, I will always do that in my career. Anything that I think, especially for the city where I'm from, if I feel like we need to be supported in that way after so much, after all that Atlanta has contributed to music, these music companies can contribute back to us in a real way. And if I'm the only black person in the room, or the only woman in the room, or the only person from Atlanta in the room with any of those other stipulations, that is my job. That's why I'm there. So that probably my proudest moment as a as a corporate employee. Yeah. No, absolutely. So how do you feel about the state of the Atlanta music business? Would you say?

Um, I feel like the state of the Atlanta music business is I always want to give us credit for growing. I I definitely think it's growing, but it's growing literally because of people from Atlanta. It's not like anybody came down from a different city and saved us. It's true. A bunch of people from LA didn't come build buildings here. A bunch of people in New York didn't come and like teach us structure and how to put this shit together. Like it's companies like LVRN, QC, even Lecrae's label. Yeah, reach reach. Yes. Having really like investing and putting buildings in here. So now we don't have a capital. We don't have an Interscope. We don't have corporate buildings. We have buildings owned by people we went to high school with. We have buildings owned with people that really grew up with Lil Baby and seen him on his street to being on the Grammys. It's still from the soil, everything. And so I'm I'm super proud that nobody had to come down and show us the way. Because I also think that that's why Atlanta's special. Like, we we don't have access to information all the time.

Like, we don't know everything, and nobody was coming down here and telling us all the secrets. People would just come and kind of steal the sauce and be like, okay, cool, they make creative shit because they don't when you don't know the rules, then you break them. And you don't because you don't know them, not because you're trying to be cool or you're trying to be disruptive, you're just doing your own shit because no one's ever told you that that's not allowed or put a boundary on this. So, like all the coolest sounds, all the coolest ad libs, all the coolest producers, all the greatest beats, all the greatest drums, everything has come from here because nobody said, No, this is exactly how you produce a song, and you can't yell mama that no one does that. Or pussy. We interviewed Mexikodro, who says, you know, like I I never learned like music theory, I don't even have speakers. I just make beats on my laptop. Like and he and you started plug, arguably. Yeah, no. So it's crazy. No, nobody was no one was down in Atlanta all these years, like giving us a whole bunch of opportunity. Not anybody that wasn't from here, like Jermaine, like LA, like all the people that really did that, it's the same as it's always been.

We create opportunities for ourselves, but now I love that we have more access to information. I think the new regime, this new era of executives, um we're friendlier with each other, even if it's a little friendly competition, we share with each other, we all hang out. Like, I'm like, I used to throw parties with Meezy. I love that him and 21 Savage's whole career together is incredible. And so we have Summer Walker, and so when Summer Walker and Usher, when you go to the old Atlanta guard, and then 21 Savage and Summer can all be on a song together. That's Atlanta. Crazy. That's the most Atlanta shit that can happen. So dope. Really? I saw that song, and I was just like, okay. You know, but they've outdone themselves. But it's because now we all know what we're doing, and we respect our elders, and our elders also respect us. That there's new information and there's an exchange of information that can happen. And so I really think like, have have we been slighted in the music industry in the past, and will we still be for sure? You know, like we again, we don't have the big buildings.

It's wild they haven't come down here. Actually, now that you're like saying it that way, it's kind of wild that all the labels didn't just at least have like some building here. Yeah, and what a presence from a lot of them where we're like, yeah, we hired somebody down here. We got one AR down there. Yeah, it's like ridiculous. Yeah, even two is like it's not good enough. Yeah. Um, hiring people or putting an office or building a studio or whatever, whatever it is you need to do to actually like invest in Atlanta. Yeah. Don't just like come and put your boots down and like ask somebody to ask somebody, Red or TP to take you to the club and and hopefully that you soak it all up and then take it back to LA. Like, no, you have to give people jobs and you need to build things and like you need to pay us. For sure. Well, Amber, I could talk to you for hours, but we have entered a final segment of the podcast. Oh no. I know, I know. That's actually how I'm feeling. I don't know if that was sarcastic. That's actually how I'm feeling. A little sad, definitely as well. That's okay.

But Amber, this is the rapid fire rampage. It's gonna be a three-part rampage. Yeah, I know. This is where we get real deep into the mind of Amber Grimes. Let me adjust my mic. I'm sweating now. Yep. We're gonna start off with some short answer questions. Short answer, like one word or short answer. Like a sentence, like, you know, or what however you feel good luck. I talk a lot. Go. So do I. Thanks. Okay. Starting with you can ask God one question. What do you ask him? Did I make you proud? Oh. Okay. Amber, an independent has exactly 1,000 to roll out a single. Give us an example of how they could spend it. $1,000. That's it. You definitely need to buy some ads. And you can like, there's platforms like Symphony where you can spend $100 on targeted ads and reach a demo of people like you. So like let's spend $100 on ads, or we can even go on our Spotify for artists and look at our top 10 cities and make sure that we spend our $100 in the places where people are listening to our music.

We're gonna like hit our homie down the street who has a camera because like we all have one. Or 10. And we're gonna ask him, you know, if he'd be willing to do an exchange on the content. But if he's not, let's give him like a hundred dollars to shoot this video. You need to dress yourself, bring your own bag of chips for crafty, like do your own thing. But like let's go to the streets where you're from, and let's make sure that we shoot a video. But let's also on that video shoot for absolutely free, shoot a bunch of short form content. I'm talking about 10 pieces. So while you got your homeboy there, you tell him you turn that camera vertically, and we let's get us some, let's get us some high-res content, okay? Yeah, um, but a lot of the creators that do mixes and remixes and mashups on TikTok, um, super friendly, and they need content ideas. DM them. This is free too. DM them, make friends with them, see how much they charge to do mashups for you and post them so that they come from your page. So now you have another piece of product.

Somebody might charge you a hundred dollars to do a mashup. Let's spend on that too, because I think new sounds are important. And there's probably a couple of other answers, but I feel like I've spent $300 and saved you a lot of money. So pay your rent. The rest. Um, and then let's react properly after we put our 10 pieces of content out. Response. That's my answer. Wow. Fire, fire. And only spent three. That's incredible. Yep. Amber, what are three things a hungry artist could do to get the attention of Amber Grimes and Love Renaissance? Continuously put out music and content until I find them or hear about them from somebody else other than them. Yeah. Only one needed. One thing. That's it, right? Okay. Did you see how she batted her eyes at you? She's like, next question, motherfucker. That was short for that's the only one I'm giving it. Love it.

Uh this segment is called Ideal Audio. Okay. We're gonna put together your perfect song. Okay. Put your AR hat on. Create the most ideal audio, the perfect song you can right now. The most perfect song to ever exist. You can't hear it, but I'm giving you the Jeopardy music right now. Oh no, okay. Don't jeopardy me. Oh my God. Okay, so I would um finally make the Ladies' night record that none of the rap girlies will make because there's too much division in the female hip hop community. Oh my gosh. Who's there? And I love a little healthy competition. I think that's always cool. But this is the most women that we've ever had at one time in the game, both in RB and in hip hop. Yeah. And it is like literally the most unfortunate time for women to not be getting along when we could totally shut down the entire genre if there was unity. Yeah.

Like it is a huge miss. It needs to stop. Again, it's not doing anybody any favors. It's not helping anybody, it's not making anybody any more money. There's enough people. There's enough TikTok. There's enough creators. There's enough everything to go around now for more than one woman to be successful in hip hop at a time, which is how it's always been. All of these women can profit off of their music. And together they would be stronger, richer, sexier, like killing the game if we cut the bullshit. Damn. Okay, just a couple more of the short answers. Okay. Actually, just one short. Yeah. Well, but you know, we're getting into the mind of Amber Grimes here. So we take the time that we need. Nice one. This is the last one. This is the last one though. Um, if you could only wear one outfit for the rest of your life. Oh shit. What would it be? Oh shit. And I bet it's not that hat from yesterday, because it looked hot. Love that hat. It looked great. I touched your hat and Henry gave me shit for it. He was like, Did you really just touch her hat?

Okay, shit. I was like, maybe I shouldn't have now that. That's pretty close to touching a black woman's hair. That, you're already like, He's already stalking you and now he's petting you. I didn't even feel it. Which is kind of weird. Oh you're in trouble. I don't know if that's better or worse. You would have told me that earlier. I would have just left. Have you guys had anybody walk out on the podcast yet? Not yet, but we're waiting. No, no. We'd love that. No, okay. Okay, At least we got this far. Yeah. I could have told you I'd touch her hat. We got the interview now. Oh my gosh. Walk out might be great now. Outfit For the rest of my life. Um, honestly, like I'm a cozy, cozy girl, contrary to like maybe sometimes what my Instagram looks like and what I wear. Um skims makes the best boyfriend joggers I have ever worn in my goddamn life. And I would wear those pants and I would have an essentials hoodie in the same uh, color gray. Kind of that Yeezy gray, you know what I'm talking about.

Mm-hmm. And a pair of Balenciagas. It's my favorite shoe in the world. The runners. The sorry, the the I don't have them on today. Not the heavy, not the big heavy ones. Yeah. But not the sock shoe, because that's dead too. It's right in the middle. It's like the trainer. It looks like an ASIC. Um a furry hat. And a furry hat. I will promise not to touch ever again. Can you believe it? I've learned that lesson. Wow. There's Staple pieces for me. And I'd put a wife beater under it just so I could be a little versatile. Oh yeah, it's smart. Smart. It's still one outfit. Yeah. It counts. In case you get hot. Yeah, for sure. Get a straight beater. This is a competition animal. Okay. Jesus. I mean, maybe she's competing with past guests, but we won't go there right now. These last two parts will be more rapid because um they're very short. Okay. This one is the this or that. I'm just gonna give two choices. All right. You gotta pick one. Starting with singing or rapping. Singing.

Melodies or drums? Melodies. Bowling or trivia? Trivia. I had a feeling. I'm a bowling guy, but Here's my Achilles heel. Face tat or tongue piercing. Oh my Jesus. Um face tat. Dogs or babies? Dogs. Hot or lemon pepper. Both of them. Give me both of them. That's why it's a good one, is because you can't choose both, but we'll move on because it's Amber Grimes. Lose your passport or lose your driver's license. Um I in the country. That's a great question. You're in this country. When I lose my passport, I'm in this country. You're stuck here. Or I lose my passport. You lose the passport? So you're stay in here, but you can drive. He's saying forever. Yeah. I can't. That's not possible. So that's not a good question. But it is my question. I believe I have a passport. I've lost my lost my passport when I was in the Bahamas one time. No stress.

Okay, I should have added the word forever. I'm not gonna lie to you now. Maybe this is why. bad wording, bad wording. once again, co-hosts out there. I'm taking applications. Yeah, I'm listening. Yeah, thank you, Amber. God bless. Okay. Um rich and famous or rich and unknown. Rich and famous. And finally, go back to Def Jam or leave the music industry. Leave the music industry. Oh shit. Now I would like to clarify that that is no shade. No clarification. But I just don't spin the block. That's all. Makes sense. Makes sense. Like there ain't nowhere to park. That's all. Yeah. Twice. Okay, yeah. The last part is the word association. Amber, I'm gonna say one word, and you just gotta give me the first word right back off the top of your head. Simple as that. You guys did not tell me that there would be games. You didn't watch the podcast. So you would have known if you knew what you're I watched the clips. Oh she's a clips watcher, huh? Unfortunately. We met so many people at Revolt that were like, we've seen your podcast, and then they're like, Well, we've actually just seen the clips. What are you making clips for if you don't want people to watch the damn clips? We do. We do. but they don't.

They don't all the time. But we're getting better. We're getting better with it. This is the word association. Here we go. Starting with hip hop. Okay. Your response to hip hop is okay. No, I'm just yeah, it is actually. It's okay. I mean, like average. That's my word. Okay. Hip hop. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Move on. R and B. Growing. Elephant. Room. What are you trying to say? I touched her hat, Henry. I touched her fucking hat. That's what she's trying to say. Alright, we'll get off the hat, the elephant thing. DJ. Drama. Glock. 40. Hiccup. Bless you. What? Do you bless people for hiccups?

No, but you said it was the first thing that came to my mind. All right. No, that's right. Love it. Australia. Never been. Bitcoin. Bitcoin. Stop. Just stop. Telemarketer. Netflix. Lemon. Pepper. Podcast. You. Lil. Baby. Love. Renaissance. Woo! This has been Amber Grimes, the motherfucking queen of rollouts. If y'all didn't soak up game in this episode, we literally can't help you. We have no hope. Yeah, you should just so much game. Holy shit. Just stop. Really appreciate you coming on. Thank you. I'm sorry for the professional uh stalking. Damn it. And you know, okay. Well it worked. I'm glad that it did it did work. You you're here right now. I never apologize for some shit that worked. Don't apologize. I don't apologize. I'm fucking standing behind that shit. Y'all should do it too.

Professional stalk all year round. Until next week, Henry, what are we doing? We're liking and uh commenting on the video and we're subscribing to the channel, and then we're getting out of here. And then we're leaving. He's fired. Thank you. Remember that. No, you're done, son. Party shit like one more time. Party one more time. Party shit like one more time. Party one more time. Oh.